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Video recording Hauptwerk performances

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csw900

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Re: Video recording Hauptwerk performances

PostThu Aug 18, 2016 2:55 am

Hi Video Recording Enthusiasts.

I have read through most of the comments above.

The best advice was given by jkinkennon.

Never waste your time using any kind of microphone -- it will never be as good as a direct
recording from Hauptwerk. Use video editing software to join the recorded audio to the video
making sure that you adjust the recording level to about 96% of maximum.

I would like to add -- use a tripod to keep the camera steady.

csw900
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Romanos

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Re: Video recording Hauptwerk performances

PostThu Aug 18, 2016 8:19 am

B777Captain wrote:Romanos...

I'll let you judge. As I listen to this, it sounds pretty darn close to the sound as I heard it when playing it live.

Pat


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TCJzG9AcsFA

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=6feVWTFctpY


I have to admit that your videos do indeed sound quite good. However, my previous comments still stand as a general rule. Your videos are very much the exception. A quick search of HW videos on YouTube will produce innumerable terribly recorded performances where pristine audio was neither synced to the video nor captured by the camera.
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Antoni Scott

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Re: Video recording Hauptwerk performances

PostThu Aug 18, 2016 10:54 am

I finally figured out how to video record simultaneously with audio recording without using an external microphone so as to retain the high fidelity of the original sample set acoustics. The solution was so simple that I couldn't believe I hadn't thought of it before.
My camera is a middle of the road image quality ( a Nikon D5500) and the built in microphone is pretty bad. The left and right microphones built into the top of the camera next to the hot shoe are about 3/4 inch apart so recording in stereo is really non-existent. I was reading the users manual ( i.e. when everything else fails read the instructions !!!!) and I noticed that on my Nikon it had a microphone plug on the side of the camera next to the USB plugs. I thought that I could run a cable from the computer's headphone plug or from one of the four the four headphone outputs in my Headphone Pre-Amp, which in my case is the PreSonus HP-4. Since I use headphones ( AKG 701's) that are of low output, it was recommended that I use a headphone pre-amplifier. The HP-4 happens to have four headphone jacks all with their own volume control. I suppose that you could use the computer's headphone output if you have a way of balancing the audio-level. In my case the Camera has a built in external audio level control since external microphones vary tremendously in their output.
I was able to set the camera's audio level using the built-in V/U meters. Some test recordings were perfect. I didn't have to buy any equipment to balance the visual recording with the audio to make sure they were in-synch, and the recording quality is exactly the same as the sample set. Microphones and especially audio speakers as well as room characteristics can have a dramatic effect of the sound that reaches the camera.

Antoni
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Antoni Scott

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Re: Video recording Hauptwerk performances

PostThu Aug 18, 2016 12:55 pm

I just recorded a simple Bach piece using the Rohrflute of the Zwolle. I would appreciate comments on the audio quality ( not the playing !!!)
Antoni


https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=PIHqKm4 ... e=youtu.be
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csw900

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Re: Video recording Hauptwerk performances

PostThu Aug 18, 2016 1:42 pm

Hi Antoni

I have just viewed and listened to your YouTube recording. It sounded OK.

I recorded the audio so I could examine the waveforms. The sound levels were
variable, as they should be, not compressed as they would be if there was any
automatic level control active.

You obviously used a tripod (or something similar) to keep the camera steady.

Now for the bad news -- it is not stereo. The waveforms on both channels are
identical.

csw900
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Antoni Scott

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Re: Video recording Hauptwerk performances

PostThu Aug 18, 2016 5:10 pm

I did some more recordings and I have to say that I am disappointed in the audio quality. It has to be the internals of the camera degrading the sound because it is coming directly from Hauptwerk. I checked and rechecked the audio and it says its stereo. There is no way to adjust left and right channels in the camera.
Too bad. I thought Pat's set up gave better results. It was a failed experiment. Its not that important to me. The video is secondary to the audio in importance. However it certainly recorded the audio and video in synch with better audio than the built in microphone on the camera.

Antoni
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csw900

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Re: Video recording Hauptwerk performances

PostFri Aug 19, 2016 2:20 am

Hi Antoni

Apologies to all I may have misled.

Your recordings ARE in stereo. They sound fine.

I have recently updated to the anniversary edition of Windows 10 and it looks as if it set
my PC to mono output.

After double checking and setting it to stereo output the audio output not only sounds
better but is definitely in stereo.

csw900
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NickNelson

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Re: Video recording Hauptwerk performances

PostFri Aug 19, 2016 5:32 am

Hi Antoni,

The Bach sounds OK to me (though I'm not playing it through a particularly top quality loudspeaker system).


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Antoni Scott

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Re: Video recording Hauptwerk performances

PostFri Aug 19, 2016 8:04 am

To CSW 900:
There could have been an absolute possibility that I had recorded the demo in mono, although this time it was in stereo. To create this demo I used one of the four headphone jacks available on my PreSonus HP4 headphone preamplifier. It was suggested back in the beginning (2008) that since the headphones I use
(AKG 701's) required more input power than other headphones, that I would need a headphone pre-amplifier. You could use the headphone jack on your PC (or in my case a Mac) if your headphones do not require as much power as do the AKG 701's. In my case, it was a small price to pay considering the outstanding quality of the AKG's. The PreSonus HP4 has a stereo/mono button on the front which can easily be accidentally depressed.

I said in a previous comment that I was disappointed in the audio quality of the video result, but that is a relative term. The good thing is that recording real time video with a Hauptwerk audio out ( such as from the HP4) eliminates any coloration of the audio by room characteristics, or speaker characteristics, etc. In this respect it is superior to using an external microphone or far superior to using the so-called stereo microphones built into the camera. The left and right microphones are only about 1/2 inch apart !!!!

I was thinking of creating a video of my Hauptwerk set-up and explaining how it evolved over time.
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Romanos

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Re: Video recording Hauptwerk performances

PostFri Aug 19, 2016 9:05 am

I thought it sounded good as well. The real limitation is going to actually be the audio compressor on the camera. DSLR's do not have high-quality audio recording even with a line in setup (although it is vastly superior to the built in mics.) It's often simple 16bit 44khz. I wouldn't worry too much, though, unless you're willing to get more equipment or sync and edit separate audio files in a video editor. Your setup is perfectly sufficient and higher quality than many other videos out there.

(Side note- if you do decide to sync uncompressed audio straight from a file recorded by HW, I would STILL run audio to your camera as you did here. The files could then sync exactly as the waveforms would be nearly identical (with the audio on the camera slightly compressed). At that point, you could have it auto sync audio and then simply mute the feed to the camera and it would turn out flawlessly. This would also completely avoid the painful hassle of trying to manually sync the audio to make it aligned frame-perfect with the video feed.)
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csw900

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Re: Video recording Hauptwerk performances

PostSat Aug 20, 2016 8:03 am

Hi Antoni

Just a last thought or two.

I have checked the specification of your D5500 camera and it seems that the 3.5mm socket
is intended for an external microphone and thus as suggested by Romanos above it will
have an automatic audio record level controller built in.

It is likely you are getting good results mainly because you are inputting a relatively low amplitude
audio signal which is below the level at which the ALC will take hold and damage your sound.
(If you have ALC active all sounds will be brought to the same level -- thus the soft passages will
sound just a loud as the loud passages -- the ruination of all music.)

I suggest you read about -- microphone automatic audio record level control -- (search words to
use in that order) on line to understand what you are dealing with.

csw900
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Antoni Scott

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Re: Video recording Hauptwerk performances

PostWed Sep 07, 2016 11:07 am

Most cameras don't have a microphone input. I was lucky with my Nikon D5500. But if your camera does have one you simply take the headphone output from your computer and plug into the microphone input. I am sure there are other ways but I solved my problem without any equipment. The audio quality is "acceptable" and completely eliminates room acoustics, microphone quality and/or speaker coloration. The only minor problem with the way I have it set up is that it prevents a running commentary. The built in camera microphone automatically switches off when you plug into the microphone input jack.

I have attached a video of the Esztergom, playing the Chorale from the Suite Gothique.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=pphY020V_lw

Antoni
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B777Captain

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Re: Video recording Hauptwerk performances

PostWed Sep 07, 2016 11:34 am

Hi Antoni...

Just an observation.... Those blinking lights on the edges of your console can be extinguished with a simple setting change on the HW menu. They were driving me mad with my setup. Lol....

Pat
Pilot Southwest Airlines
Las Vegas, Nevada
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