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A Virtual Cimbelstern App

PostPosted: Sun Nov 26, 2017 10:37 am
by rogbi200
I apologise if this is not directly Hauptwerk related, but I was thinking the other day:

As I play the pipe organ that I am privileged to play week by week, with its 17th century case, it would be fun to have access over the busy Christmas period to a Cymbelstern, or Zimbelstern, or Clochettes, however you care to call such a device. Now I do have access to some Sanctus bells, that if shaken carefully, sound like some of the bell samples that I have heard on various Hauptwerk instruments. I have thought of using one of these via Hauptwerk on my laptop, connected to a speaker. But I reckon this would be fiddly to set up and operate, but please do suggest a way that this might be possible should something occur to you...
I wonder if one of the sample set providers or another user might consider developing a digital Cymbelstern app for a Smart phone, so the phone could sit on the music desk with a nice big button to press, and connect to a speaker either over Bluetooth or audio cable. It could have unpitched and pitched (transposable) bells. The speed could be adjustable. It could even have a nice spinning star animation on the screen!

I know there are audio samples out there, and perhaps someone has already done this? I suspect more than a few of us who play a pipe organ might appreciate this small digital enhancement over the coming weeks?! If not, then might I have given someone with more time available an interesting idea for a project?

Re: A Virtual Cimbelstern App

PostPosted: Sun Nov 26, 2017 12:28 pm
by lefranc22
Do yu know this free small small sample-set?
http://hauptwerk-augustine.info/Bells-from-Komarom

Re: A Virtual Cimbelstern App

PostPosted: Sun Nov 26, 2017 2:10 pm
by Charles Braund
You might like to try this one gratis.

http://www.silveroctopus.co.uk/CYMBELSTERN.wav

Just the basic waveform untied to HW or anything else. It's up to you how you include it into any app that you decide upon.

Best,
Charles Braund

Re: A Virtual Cimbelstern App

PostPosted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 12:50 pm
by andrewhj
Lovely!
Just one (dumb newby) question: how do I add this to an organ I have already loaded, or can it only be played alone?

Re: A Virtual Cimbelstern App

PostPosted: Wed Nov 29, 2017 2:18 pm
by chr.schmitz
Hello Andrew,

Unfortunately, it is not possible to load more than one sample set at the same time.

Best, Chris

Re: A Virtual Cimbelstern App

PostPosted: Thu Nov 30, 2017 10:44 am
by OrganoPleno
andrewhj wrote:Just one (dumb newby) question: how do I add this to an organ I have already loaded, or can it only be played alone?


You would have to modify the Organ Definition File. If it's not encrypted, then it is theoretically possible. Maybe by studying another one that already has a cimbelstern and seeing what code they use to implement that, and then modifying the other file accordingly. Not a trivial project, certainly.

Re: A Virtual Cimbelstern App

PostPosted: Thu Nov 30, 2017 1:00 pm
by mdyde
Hello Andrew,

To add to others' replies, you could potentially create your own organ definition from scratch using Hauptwerk Custom Organ Design Module (CODM), including ranks from one or more sample sets, with whatever specification you liked (and including a Cimbelstern stop). The CODM's user guide is on the Help menu in Hauptwerk, but it would be a moderately involved and technical undertaking.

Re: A Virtual Cimbelstern App

PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 2:53 am
by ggoode_sa
If you have an unencrypted Organ Definition File, then I can help you add this.

GrahamG

Re: A Virtual Cimbelstern App

PostPosted: Fri Dec 01, 2017 5:52 pm
by TheOrganDoc
I have seen in the past, newly manufactured Zimbelstern's , in my catalogs from an Organ parts supply company, at a reasonable price !
, I would gladly look it up, and reply to you with their contact info.
"Nothing like the real thing" especially with bells !
Mel Wexler

Re: A Virtual Cimbelstern App

PostPosted: Sat Dec 02, 2017 3:41 pm
by rogbi200
Many thanks for the replies. Project Virtual Cymbelstern is making progress.

Many thanks in particular to Charles Braund for offering a Cymbelstern sample. I took this and edited to allow it to loop reasonably effectively. In Audacity, I boosted the volume, changed the speed a little and created different versions repitched to some other useful keys. The exported .wav files were then imported into the Launchpad iPhone app, which allows them to be looped (but not with a separate attack and decay, so not too authentic but OK for a proof of concept and usable among those not familiar with the real thing). I’m using a small but punchy 20w Bluetooth portable speaker, and the sound from phone can be output via this speaker, placed in a suitable position by the organ case, with the phone on the Music desk, and big buttons to activate/stop the differently pitched samples. It can also adjust the speed and volume though not on the fly.

Next steps-
Try and find an app that can deal with attack, looped sustain and decay- possibly a DJ app for radio backing music- (intro, looped middle whilst the traffic news etc is read, and ending)
Try and use an Arduino or BBC microbit to drive a small servo motor with a rotating star, and link it to the app so that the app can also drive the star!

I’ll just have to see how it all works over the coming weeks and remember to put the rest of the phone in flight mode to avoid incoming calls/notifications!

Thank you Mel also for the offer of a link to the real thing. I have found some online by web searching but beyond my budget, so if there is something portable that could sit near the console and be activated easily , I would be interested!

David

Re: A Virtual Cimbelstern App

PostPosted: Sat Dec 23, 2017 8:43 pm
by scottherbert
To be honest, with all due respect to my friend Mel, and the other posters, they are really simple to build!!! There are many videos on YouTube showing how to make a simple one for very little money with little more than a hobby motor and some small bells or wind chimes. Turning it on or off is as simple as activating a stop!

~S