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iPad and Hauptwerk

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iPad and Hauptwerk

Postby dwood » Thu May 13, 2010 1:09 pm

We tried a little experiment....

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=SwT2-zEhPgo

I hope it gives everyone some ideas.

Darryl
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Re: iPad and Hauptwerk

Postby B. Milan » Thu May 13, 2010 2:37 pm

Hi Darryl,

Thanks for posting this.

Just so that our users are clear, Hauptwerk is not supported for use on an iPad and cannot be installed on an iPad. I assume you must have used a remote access app to get the Skinner console on the display from your main Hauptwerk computer?

Certainly an interesting means for communicating with the console!

(Sent from my iPad)
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Brett Milan
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http://www.milandigitalaudio.com
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Re: iPad and Hauptwerk

Postby imcg110 » Thu May 13, 2010 2:46 pm

That's just great for those parts of the world that can get an ipad :-(
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Re: iPad and Hauptwerk

Postby Marco » Thu May 13, 2010 2:50 pm

if HW came out with an ipad app it would likely make it even easier for folks to build their own consoles, no need to worry about finding a touchscreen and getting the drivers to work etc., just buy two of the cheapest ipad and done, right/left stop screens with minimal fuss.
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Re: iPad and Hauptwerk

Postby B. Milan » Thu May 13, 2010 2:55 pm

I'm afraid we will not be creating a version of Hauptwerk for the iPad as this device is not meant to handle this type of professional audio application and requires a completely different coding language. Using it to remotely access an existing installation on another computer will certainly work as I believe Darryl has shown.
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Re: iPad and Hauptwerk

Postby Marco » Thu May 13, 2010 3:03 pm

I think you are misunderstanding my 'comes out with an ipad app', which would simply be a much more hw-oriented version of what is show in this video (likely with better performance on screen refreshes, which could be done locally, and with support for X ipads): I do not think anybody could advocate HW actually running on the ipad :)

Of course I am not implying you'd want to come out with something like it, just that if you did I'm pretty sure people would find good use out of it...

To clarify what I mean (people not interested in programming etc. can stop reading now :) )

- hw creates the pixmap of the stop panel (left/right/...)
- the ipad(s) connects to hw over wifi and identify themselves as left/right/...
- hw sends the ipad(s) the pixmap and a list of button locations/shapes within the pixmap
- the ipad now can do screen redraws independently from hw, and just transmit over wifi 'user pressed button x'

this ought to be reasonably simple to code, and much more high performance/easier to config than running a full VNC solution (which is what I assume is happening in the video)
Last edited by Marco on Thu May 13, 2010 3:06 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: iPad and Hauptwerk

Postby dwood » Thu May 13, 2010 3:04 pm

Yes, we used Ultra VNC (the free version) to run it since we were running Hauptwerk on a PC. Macs would just have to go to "sharing" in "internet and wireless" in System Preferences do the same. The VNC software is already built into the Mac OS.

You are correct that we just mirrored the output of the screen. Hauptwerk is not running on the iPad (I thought mentioned that in the video but best to clarify lest you receive many excited calls). Sorry, if I caused any confusion.

In this case, we only intended to show this as a potential control surface that allowed dynamic resizing.

I already had an iPad applications blog subscribe to that post. So there may be some visibility. I just sent it to my friend at http://www.ohgizmo.com as well.
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Re: iPad and Hauptwerk

Postby B. Milan » Thu May 13, 2010 3:05 pm

Marco wrote:I think you are misunderstanding my 'comes out with an ipad app', which would simply be a much more hw-oriented version of what is show in this video (likely with better performance on screen refreshes, which could be done locally, and with support for X ipads): I do not think anybody could advocate HW actually running on the ipad :)

Of course I am not implying you'd want to come out with something like it, just that if you did I'm pretty sure people would find good use out of it...


Hello Marco,

OK, sorry I misunderstood you.
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Re: iPad and Hauptwerk

Postby Marco » Thu May 13, 2010 3:07 pm

I edited my post, but I should just have re-replied to clarify what I meant :)

(people not interested in programming etc. can stop reading now :) )

- hw creates the pixmap of the stop panel (left/right/...)
- the ipad(s) connects to hw over wifi and identify themselves as left/right/...
- hw sends the ipad(s) the pixmap and a list of button locations/shapes within the pixmap
- the ipad now can do screen redraws independently from hw, and just transmit over wifi 'user pressed button x'

this ought to be reasonably simple to code, and much more high performance/easier to config than running a full VNC solution (which is what I assume is happening in the video)
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Re: iPad and Hauptwerk

Postby mdyde » Thu May 13, 2010 3:20 pm

Hello Marco,

this ought to be reasonably simple to code


Nonetheless, several months of work to do it properly, and to a professional and seamlessly-integrated standard. Nice idea, but one for the longer-term, I think!
Best regards,
Martin.

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Re: iPad and Hauptwerk

Postby Marco » Thu May 13, 2010 3:32 pm

I am sure this is not one of those 'oh, let's have it ready by next friday COB' kind of projects ;) still one wonders if the ipad might become some sort of standard 'remote screen' hardware component for kiosks and other vertical applications, as the screen quality/reading angle of it is excellent, and its price quite low for what it does...
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Re: iPad and Hauptwerk

Postby mdyde » Thu May 13, 2010 3:43 pm

Indeed. Remember, though, that you can already do it (as Darryl has demonstrated), and very easily in the case of Hauptwerk running on a Mac (just select the sharing option). My guess would be that the CPU overheads for sharing the desktop in that way would be very small (probably negligible, compared to the overheads of running Hauptwerk itself), so I rather doubt that the performance benefit from us developing a dedicated iPad controller would be significant (although I don't know that for certain without actually measuring the performance impact of sharing the desktop via the native OS X functionality).
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Re: iPad and Hauptwerk

Postby Marco » Thu May 13, 2010 4:08 pm

In my (long) experience with VNC solutions there is usually a significant delay for any non-system-toolkit UI elements to be propagated to the client: if a system toolkit element (pushbutton etc.) is interacted with, things are usually fairly speedy, but the HW main screen is probably treated as a giant pixmap by the vnc solution and so it gets sent down the wire a lot slower.

If you want to see a similar effect, just VNC to any desktop and load up a web browser, you will see that operating the menus tends to be quite fast, on a LAN up to the point of being nearly indistinguishable from native, but load up a webpage with a lot of graphics and scroll it up/down and any illusion of speed will quickly be shattered :)

Having an actual app running on the remote screen that is doing all the pixmap manipulation (turning a button on/off whether simply or actually animating it in pseudo-3d or whatever) would be a lot faster from the user perspective, not to mention that it'd probably be tricky to configure a VNC solution to work with two separate stop tabs (in my experience VNC and multimonitor setups can be iffy in terms of compatibility).

From a business standpoint I likely wouldn't be spending development time on it (the ROI would be hard to justify compared to other features that might affect the bottom line more directly) but from a 'cool!' standpoint it does seem like something fun :)
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Re: iPad and Hauptwerk

Postby Ch. Nabe » Fri May 14, 2010 7:47 am

Nice to see this as I intend to use my iPad (to be delivered) for that purpose.
Did anybody try this VNC solution in realtime playing? Is it fast/responsive enough?

Greetings
Christian
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