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Four Manual Hauptwerk Instrument

Building organ consoles for use with Hauptwerk, adding MIDI to existing consoles, obtaining parts, ...
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RUCKPOSITIVE

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Four Manual Hauptwerk Instrument

PostTue Nov 04, 2014 9:11 pm

I'm interested in making contact with anyone who is in the process of or has completed a Four Manual Hauptwerk Instrument.

I'm on a rapidly enclining learning curve at the moment - like so many with who are new here with little or know knowledge but heaps of enthusiasm and a determination to succeed.

I was fortunate recently to be able to purchase a 32 note concave radiating Compton Royal College of Organists pedalboard along with two stacks of handcrafted 2 manual solid wood clavier. All five clavier are of the finest craftsmanship.

Since my first post I am no longer interested in using reed switches and even if there were any stability in them would not have done so since I wish to incorporate second touch for Theater Organ work.

I'm sure there must be people out there who have successfully created a system which allows for the emulation of tracker action. That is something I am also interested in.

As I said I have two stacks of two clavier each.

If I mount them as would be expected the first two slot into the dowl as normal.

Mounting a third on top is no problem since it will balance with ease - however the fourth is far too heavy at the back and will not balance.

I need therefore, eventually, to come up with a solution for securing the stacks at the correct pitch and to create appropriate new key cheaks.

It's also become apparent that if there were a problem with one of the lower manuals it would be necessary to dismount each clavier one by one to get to it - I can't honestly see anyway around this and don't think that it would be possible to create some sort of hinging system.

I've also not come across anyone who has built a four clavier stack. Yes there are many out there but they all seem to have been purchased midified. If you know of anyone who has you may be able to introduce me to them.

Or maybe there is somebody who has purchased one of these stacks who would be kind enough post some images of their internal workings.

MIZPAH

Stef
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engrssc

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Re: Four Manual Hauptwerk Instrument

PostTue Nov 04, 2014 9:42 pm

RUCKPOSITIVE wrote:Mounting a third on top is no problem since it will balance with ease - however the fourth is far too heavy at the back and will not balance.

I need therefore, eventually, to come up with a solution for securing the stacks at the correct pitch and to create appropriate new key cheaks.

It's also become apparent that if there were a problem with one of the lower manuals it would be necessary to dismount each clavier one by one to get to it - I can't honestly see anyway around this and don't think that it would be possible to create some sort of hinging system.


While I have built only 3M instruments, there really should not be a problem with hinging them in order to gain access to each manual. Obviously the lowest manual needs the longest cheek with the next manual a shorter cheek, etc.

The metal bracket (one on each side the manuals) that fastens to the manuals is in the shape of a triangle. The lower and the rear sides being 90 degrees from each other. The third side is diagonal with the hinge point for each manual being on that diagonal. When in a raised position, each manual is perpendicular upright to the key desk. They each swing upwards with the hinge point near the rear, lower edge of the cheek. This point with respect to the metal mounting bracket(s) at each side can determine the pitch of each manual. [The pitch is determined by the shape of the (upper manual) cheeks.]These metal (side) brackets are fastened to the key desk.

Shouldn't matter how many manuals are mounted in this manner. Any couplers or controls under the music rack has to be able to be moved out of the way. In the case of my Rodgers 340, which is a Theatre instrument. the stop rail(s) actually hinge forward, (consider it toward the organist (playing) position, while the manuals hinge backward toward the rear of the organ. Kinda weird how it looks, but it makes for everything being accessible.

Rgds,
Ed
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Andrew Grahame

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Re: Four Manual Hauptwerk Instrument

PostWed Nov 05, 2014 5:33 am

Hi Stef,

A while back I documented the rebuilding of my old 3-manual console into 4.

So far the thread has received more than 9,600 views - I'm astonished!

viewtopic.php?f=21&t=11506

I would be happy to discuss any aspect of this with you - just send me a PM.

Andrew
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RUCKPOSITIVE

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Re: Four Manual Hauptwerk Instrument

PostWed Nov 05, 2014 6:49 am

Captain Kirk should definitely be proud of the completed project to date Andrew.

No wonder you have had so many hits on the post - there is so much information on it and it details the things people need to ponder and sort out in their thinking.

Great work - and yes I'll be picking your brains continually now that you have opened the flood gate ;-)

Stef
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Organorak

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Re: Four Manual Hauptwerk Instrument

PostWed Nov 12, 2014 6:39 pm

There have been a few threads on simulating mechanical/tracker action. The principle is achieved by slightly increasing the key resistance when you first depress the key. The two methods most often employed are either having little rubber bubbles under each key which deform when the key is pressed, or mounting a magnet on each key which attracts the key to an iron bar which runs the whole width of the keyboard behind the thumbrail of the manual above.

For touch sensitivity you need two sensors per key to measure the velocity with which you depress the key.

Certain Fatar keyboards such as the TP6 that I use (used in Midiworks keyboards) are both touch sensitive and have a "tracker" feel to them via the rubber bubbles - and can connect to a MIDI circuit board meaning you don't have to MIDIfy them, so are good "out the box" solutions unless you have keyboards from an existing instrument that you want to use. I have not hinged them, so to take them out (if I needed to repair a piston or faulty note for instance) means having to dismantle all the keyboards. It is a nuisance, but should be rarely needed once the organ has been set up correctly. Here are some pictures of my console and its construction:

viewtopic.php?f=21&t=10878

viewtopic.php?f=15&t=7771
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edesaux

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Re: Four Manual Hauptwerk Instrument

PostThu Oct 22, 2015 2:45 am

Hello Rückpositive,
I'm in France too, and I'm looking for making a console for theatre organ, with 2 keyboards with 2nd touch. Did you find a solution ? I would be glad to talk with you, because I don't know anybody interested in Miditzer in France...
Kind regards, ED
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Andrew Grahame

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Re: Four Manual Hauptwerk Instrument

PostThu Oct 22, 2015 5:01 am

My console uses four Behringer UMX-610 keyboards. The keys are velocity sensitive. Hauptwerk recognises this feature and uses it as a substitute for second touch. I would imagine that real second touch contacts would be expensive to buy and challenging to make yourself. I understand that the Behringer key action is the same as that of Fatar keyboards.

Andrew
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Antoni Scott

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Re: Four Manual Hauptwerk Instrument

PostFri Oct 30, 2015 4:40 pm

My present console is a four manual Hauptwerk conversion. I can give you all the information I have regarding the conversion process. It started out as a three manual Schantz pipe organ console and about two years ago I added the fourth manual. It was actually quite easy to convert. I wanted to make the process as easy as possible and opted to use the MKS Fatar keyboards rather than wire all the key and thumb pistons to digital scanning boards. I kept the Schantz pedal board because it was so nice and matched the console and bench.

Antoni

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