Would a serious organist play this organ?

Hi Neumie. In response to your original question, I will answer for myself, and only myself, with no. I am a serious classical organist, and I do not care for piano 'type' or 'style' keyboards at all. I like my organ to be 100% organ like, with tracker touch keyboards, and 32 note pedalboard. When I do play piano (and I do), I like that to feel like a piano, so I have a piano keyboard with the weighted keys, sustain pedal, etc.

It is as an old friend said to me, when ask something to do everything, it may do everything, but nothing well. Divide and conquer. But that is just my dos centavos.

Half the fun is in the dreaming!
~Scott

Hi Scott,

Can I please benefit from your experience? I'm still essentially new to organs, learning my basic skills and still just playing on one manual with one registration. Big things are coming, I'm sure.

You said you would not play that organ I pictured with the piano on the bottom and the three organ manuals above. Hypothetically, if someone offered a serious organist (who also plays a little piano on a digital keyboard) an organ with three manuals, but also gave him the choice of an organ like the one pictured ... why wouldn't an organist take the 3x organ plus 1x piano manuals over just three normal organ manuals without the piano?

I'm guessing that the piano keyboard on the bottom requires you to reach higher and forward than you would otherwise ... but other than that, I can't think of a disadvantage over that 3+1 over a regular three manual organ. (I'm assuming both hypothetical organs would have three organ manuals. One just adds the piano in addition to the others.)

I guess the real question is, is having to reach up and over a "piano manual" a hassle and does that mess up an advanced organist? Does an organist get so acclimated to having the lowest manual right in front of him that having to reach over a piano keyboard to play ruin the playing experience?

Then there are 4 and 5 manual classical organs. Of course a majority of our "work" is done of the Great probably, but I see no disadvantage playing a piano right hand "solo" part accompanied by a left hand on the organ manuals especially where (musician) budget might be a factor. .

Wonder how CC would comment, or if he's even into pianos? Then there are many talented theatre organists who play a multitude of other instruments, even an occasional crash cymbal. (But not in church.)

Rgds,
Ed

Seems to me (a ignorant beginner with no actual experience) that it would really mess a guy up suddenly having his lowest manual two inches higher and eight or so inches forward. Do that to a pianist and see what happens to his playing.

So if you were fully acclimated to a normal three manual organ, Ed, and played advanced classical repertoire (which wouldn't really permit using a "weighted piano manual" at all as the feel would be so different from the other manuals) ... you wouldn't mind having to now reach up and over the piano manual to play?

Out of (sort of) a need, I played a 2M organ I had never played before prior to Christmas 2015 with piano keyboard (stacked) on top of the upper manual. This was mainly due to the fact that the keyboard player got seriously ill a couple hours before a major choral concert. I had probably 20 minutes to "adjust". Bottom line, it really wasn't too bad. Even "normal" critics applauded the performance. And, yes, it probably would have been better with a separate organist and a separate pianist. But sometimes, one does what one does even tho it wasn't perfect. The biggest problem was there was no place for the music score, fortunately I had memorized my organ part and basically ad libbed the piano part. Looking back, I think I actually enjoyed the challenge but if given a choice, wouldn't do it again. I try to not put the word "can't" in my vocab.

Rgds,
Ed

Hi Neumie, sorry it took me so long to reply to your question. I guess the answer is that I REALLY like playing organ, and I REALLY like the organ feel. I feel most comfortable with the French 'Grande Orgue' on the lowest manual, closest to me. For me, changing the feel and the style from tracker action click, to weighted piano type, just wouldn't jive in my brain! Also, and importantly, I do not play popular music so someone that does would probably be more flexible, hence pianos on theater organs. I, however, would rather concentrate on the touch of the piano when I play the piano, and organ when I play organ, (or harpsichord etc.).

It isn't so much that the piano keyboard is "in the way", as "why is it therein the first place?" The old home "entertainment center" organ from Thomas and Lowery tried to do everything for people that didn't even know how to play. Automated rhythm centers and chords. But you asked about a serious organist! A serious organist plays an organ! In the style he/she prefers. When he/she wants to play piano, then I think there are a lot of fine pianos and digital pianos available. The digital ones don't take up much space and can use the same sound system as the Hauptwerk!

As I always say, this is for me, and everyone else is welcome to their own opinion. Also, if your organ keyboards do not have the tracker touch, then the difference will be less noticeable, and easier to acclimate.

~Scott

Hey Ed,

Who is the CC you referred to? Is his first name Aristide?

Also, Neumie,

My wife said that I MAY have come off a little like a snob on my last post, so I apologize! I just had my nose rubbed in those nasty "entertainer" organs as a kid (I still have nightmares of those danged automated drum machines following in the dark! ) I found true, and I do mean TRUE joy the first time I got to play real pipes!!! No rhythm, no percussion, no sustain, just true timbre! She stole my heart and I've never looked back.

So I'm sorry if I sound like a snob, but perhaps we are all somewhat snobbish about that which we love.

Now pass the popcorn, the movie is starting.

~Scott

CC is Cameron Carpenter.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=F79BgeqyXhI

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=nk7N09n6tfo

While looking for YouTube videos of CC, (and there is a huge number of them), I came across
a lecture he did in 2010 at the University of Michigan. In this lecture, among many of his very
unique and even controversial views of music, he extols the need of a virtual pipe organ
over a real pipe organ. Instead of playing the Barton T/O, he demonstrates some of these
aspects of (his) music using a grand piano. The lecture, altho quite long - 01:23:23 - is quite
captivating and even compelling. I watched, actually mostly listened to the lecture while
working on a rebuild of my 340 control system components. Amazing how stimulating
something such as this can be while doing a more mondain task like soldering..

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=JeOvWB8TeV0&spfreload=10

Rgds,
Ed