Finally Starting My Console

I would have, had I known when I started what I know now! I liked the idea of using a central MIDI controller for all stops, couplers, and keys. If I had realized the modifications needed to the keybed, I would have retained the M-Audio circuitry. I might still for the remaining three keybeds I have yet to purchase, assuming they all play nice with what I have built so far.

Lesson learned - never throw anything away until you're sure you won't need it!

Sent you a PM assuming that you are in the USA?

Also did you find the diode matrix to be 8x8 or 5x12+1?

Thomas

Also did you find the diode matrix to be 8x8 or 5x12+1?

Having dismantled one myself, I recall them being 2x8x8 (being velocity sensing).

Nick

Yes, definitely a 2x8x8, which made things fairly easy in terms of integrating the keybed with the controller. I also simplified my work by using only one set of diodes, the set that triggers earlier in the key action.

I've been kind of watching this post since a few older links were provided by Luis where I had thrown in my 2-1/2 cents worth in the past on using M-Audio keyboards and components, which are still in use to this day by the way.

Don't take any of this the wrong way, but yes it sure looks like a lot of extra work has taken place here when the needed parts to easily do the job were already there for the taking. I'd rather be playing already vs. totally re-engineering things that really don't need that done in the first place. Some of the positives for me to use the M-Audio circuits / components was the fact they are a simple USB connection and are powered via USB (no additional power supplies involved), and or the circuit boards for the various sliders and so on plug right into the main circuit board and do their job, all I needed to do depending on what component I was using was some simple engineering or extend wire lengths to get things placed where I need them, i.e. the crescendo and swell pedals as an example. All of the M-Audio circuit boards range from about the size of a postage stamp up to about the size of a regular business card making them VERY simple to mount and hide away inside the console (read that as very little room taken up for maybe some kind of future add on?). AND again, the additional components (volume slider, wheels, etc.) can easily be modified to use for crescendo and other things, no fuss, no muss. I also have spares should something conk out on me.

As for one controller for everything, my thinking is IF that one controller goes down the whole 9 yards may go down, read that as potentially no organ to play until that one controller is fixed. In my case if something acts up I can quickly identify which component is causing the trouble because keyboard controllers only control keyboards, crescendo controller only controls crescendo, etc,. etc. Using perhaps a car guy analogy, if it's an eight cylinder engine and one plug quits and you're running on 7 cylinders, you can still get to where you're going and when you have time to fix it, you replace one simple and inexpensive part vs. the entire engine.

Marc

All this is true. If I had not started down the path I have, and knowing now the work involved, I probably would have done it differently.

That said, this 5 manual console involves way more work than the keyboard controller(s), considering there's going to be well over 100 stop/coupler controls to wire in as well, pedals, swell/crescendo, pistons, lighting for the lit controls, etc.

I have a pretty decent electronics background, so in the end it hopefully will all work out well together. The woodworking, on the other hand, is a going to be an education...

I appreciate the feedback!

As for one controller for everything, my thinking is IF that one controller goes down the whole 9 yards may go down, read that as potentially no organ to play until that one controller is fixed. In my case if something acts up I can quickly identify which component is causing the trouble because keyboard controllers only control keyboards, crescendo controller only controls crescendo, etc,. etc.

I've thought about this as well. I always have a separate encoder on the pedalboard. My other projects have been a mix, some with individual keyboard encoders, some with an 'all-in-one' system. But usability when a component fails is defiinitely something to consider...

---john.

Just to give a quick example, I have one wire going to my pedal board encoder that once in awhile decides not to make a solid contact and I end up with a dead D#. I immediately know what the problem is and a quick wiggle of the wiring harness at the pedal board encoder brings things back up, whereas having a single controller for everything you might be searching for the problem the next 3 days. I like the simple process of elimination. I've just never been a fan of all in one controllers for anything and a good example of this is our local church electronic organ, it has one encoder in particular that goes out from time to time and when it happens the entire organ goes out, nothing works, pistons, tilt tabs, stops, keyboards, nothing, it's dead in the water until the repairman shows up with a new board. At least in my case I can still play although I could end up being down one keyboard or something like that.

Marc

What did you use to support your m-audio 61es keyboards into the key cheeks?

What did you use to support your m-audio 61es keyboards into the key cheeks?

The 61es keyboards are in a nice sturdy frame when removed from the plastic case and basically have legs with holes tapped for screws. I used simple clear pine 1" x 8" as the base of each keyboard, marked the location of the legs of the keyboards on the pine, then drilled holes in those locations with a countersink to allow the screw heads to be flush, and ran the screws in from the bottom into the keyboard legs. For the key cheeks I drilled holes in the sides, again with a countersink, screwed the cheeks to the ends of the boards the keyboards are mounted on and used wood plugs to hide the screws on the sides of the cheeks. Once sanded and stained the plugs were just about completely invisible.

Marc

That sounds like a plan Marc, Thanks you!! Would you have pictures by any chance?

Here's a picture of how I mounted mine - not the best picture, but it should get the point across. I have two lengths of popular set into the oak keycheeks and glued. The keycheeks are carved to allow the poplar to sit flush with the bottom of the keycheek, and then holes are drilled to allow the keybed to be screwed to the poplar.

Please ignore my messy piston wiring. It will be neatened up eventually.

I'm so grateful the forum is back up! Here's an update:

I finished off the top two manuals. All six general pistons are wired and working (not lighted, but that's a future enhancement - the wiring is in place, just need to add the controller). The top manual's six generals are combined with the six righthand pistons on the bottom manual. The lefthand divisionals aren't wired in yet.

My brother bought me a swell pedal for Christmas! This is one of the five needed, but it's great to practice mounting it and getting it wired to the controller. It works great, and (to me) looks great. The mounting board is temporary...eventually it will be mounted in the console, which is yet to be built. With a Aeolian-Skinner Viola Pomposa/Celeste and the swell closed...ohh it sounds heavenly.

That sounds like a plan Marc, Thanks you!! Would you have pictures by any chance?

Currently, no I don't have any pictures but was planning to take and post a few at some point. It's a pretty simple arrangement, just picture a flat board with the keyboard mounted to it and key cheeks at each end. The crucial part was positioning the keyboard on the base board front to rear, I mocked everything up on my workbench before actually putting it all together, once you have one set up then from there it's basically copy what you have for the next set of keys. I made the key cheeks so they were flush with the top surface of the naturals like it was originally as Allen organ did it. From there all it took was a bit of careful measuring to have the base board the correct width end to end so when I attached the key cheeks at each end there was a slight gap between them and the keys at each end, was actually pretty simple. Under the keys in front I cut and installed a 1/4" thick by about 2" high maple strips to hide the underside of the keys but still allowed room for the keys to fully travel down without hitting them, these I installed with screws again as Allen organ originally did. Picture the boards that are under the keys where the pistons would mount, but in my case no pistons.

Marc

NICE!, You didn't have to trim the keys on the 61es's did you?