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Kimber Allen Swell pedal

Building organ consoles for use with Hauptwerk, adding MIDI to existing consoles, obtaining parts, ...

Kimber Allen Swell pedal

Postby tomaszartur » Thu May 11, 2017 2:51 pm

Hi,
Could someone please tell what else will I need to make this swell pedal from Kimber Allen working with my midi keyboards please?

https://ibb.co/fFZRAk

Do I need some midi controller as well?
I'm trying to get 2 x swell pedal for my midi pedalboard and I'm not sure wher to look for it?

Best,
Tom
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Re: Kimber Allen Swell pedal

Postby johnh » Fri May 12, 2017 12:54 am

Hi,

Nice pedal.

Typically in a virtual organ console the position of the swell pedal is determined by measuring the voltage across a variable resistor. Most commonly either a slide or rotary potentiometer is mechanically coupled to the swell pedal. Then a MIDI encoder converts this voltage to a numeric value as part of a MIDI message that is sent to the computer.

The pedal you pictured has discrete contacts and is designed to be used in a traditional pipe organ with a limited number of inputs for swell shade position. You could use these existing contacts but it wouldn't be ideal.

Perhaps the easiest thing to do would be to use a linear potentiometer and a small MIDI encoder such as the midihardware.com MBBS (https://www.midi-hardware.com/index.php?section=prod_info&product=MBBS) or the Highly Liquid MIDI CPU or the Teensy (Arduino compatabile) board.

If you wanted to use the existing contacts and were content with the fixed positions ( 8, 16, or 32) you could use a series of resistors to create a varying resistance as the pedal is moved and use one of the encoders as described above. If you went the Teensy (Arduino) route you could read the inputs directly and calculate your own values in software, no additional potentiometer required.

As always, lots of options! :-)
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Re: Kimber Allen Swell pedal

Postby NickNelson » Fri May 12, 2017 2:48 am

Hi Tom,

I would start by considering what your MIDI pedalboard has to offer in terms of potential expression inputs.

Nick.
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Re: Kimber Allen Swell pedal

Postby engrssc » Fri May 12, 2017 3:24 am

A speculative thought/question - wonder if a stepped swell ped would be more realistic as compared to using a potentiometer. And further, which amount of steps - 8, 16, 32? OTOH, maybe it wouldn't matter.

And for further realism, maybe a stepped swell ped would, with the right organ noise samples, be able to recreate accurately the sound of old, noisy swell shades flapping away in the background. :roll:

And then there is the more ultimate realism factor that tends to reproduce everything, including the flaws. :mrgreen:

Rgds,
Ed
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Re: Kimber Allen Swell pedal

Postby deWaverley » Fri May 12, 2017 5:27 am

Tom - I looked at those Kimber Allen ones too, but what you need are these pedals, which have a lovely firm and solid action:

http://www.fatar.com/Pages/FP_70.html

They are sold in the UK by Douglas Henn-Macrae (DHM on this forum) - http://en.midi-organs.eu and cost a very reasonable £85 each (...at least they did when I bought them).

Douglas could advise you about connecting them to your Hauptwerk setup, but I used a little ready-made circuit board from Roman Sowa: https://www.midi-hardware.com/index.html

It looks like the current cheapest option is the PDS on this page: https://www.midi-hardware.com/index.php ... =EUR&grp=1

But send Roman an email and he will advise you what is best.

It's all very simple really once you get down to it - good luck!
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Re: Kimber Allen Swell pedal

Postby NickNelson » Fri May 12, 2017 6:34 am

I might be wrong but it looks as though the PDS unit need connecting to one of the master controllers.

As I said before, what you need rather depends on what you already have. But if you wanted me to, I could send you one of my encoders, described here for £10 plus postage,

http://www.personal.leeds.ac.uk/~edu6nwn/midistuff/MegaMidi8_design.pdf

Image
or one of the prototypes I have lying around (less posh board but fully functional) for just the postage cost.

If were really keen to used the KA swells I could probably reprogram an encoder to scan and encode several of them (though it wouldn't then be able to deal with the pedal notes as well).

Note that my encoders are serial MIDI IN/OUT only, no USB I'm afraid.

Nick
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Re: Kimber Allen Swell pedal

Postby GrahamH » Fri May 12, 2017 8:55 am

Nick wrote
I might be wrong but it looks as though the PDS unit need connecting to one of the master controllers.


That is correct. The PDS unit supports up to three expression pedals but needs to be connected to a master controller.
The PEDSCAN unit is stand-alone but only supports one expression pedal.

Graham
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Re: Kimber Allen Swell pedal

Postby dhm » Fri May 12, 2017 11:49 am

deWaverley wrote:Tom - I looked at those Kimber Allen ones too, but what you need are these pedals, which have a lovely firm and solid action:
http://www.fatar.com/Pages/FP_70.html
They are sold in the UK by Douglas Henn-Macrae (DHM on this forum) - http://en.midi-organs.eu and cost a very reasonable £85 each (...at least they did when I bought them).
Douglas could advise you about connecting them to your Hauptwerk setup...

Thanks, deWaverley, for the tag.
I'm afraid they are £95 each now, thanks to post Brexit referendum exchange rates.
They come via Hoffrichter with a 1/4 inch jack plug (which would normally connect to one of his keyboard blocks).
Douglas Henn-Macrae
Authorized Hauptwerk Reseller
http://www.midi-organs.eu / http://www.gundulf.org.uk
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Re: Kimber Allen Swell pedal

Postby tomaszartur » Sun May 14, 2017 3:25 am

Thank you for all the answers.

At the moment I'm trying to midify my pedalboard. I'm going to get PDS and Reed 32 from Roman Sowa.
It could be too complicated for me to midiy the Kimber Allen swell pedal.
I think I will go with the one from Fatar.

Thank you.
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Re: Kimber Allen Swell pedal

Postby engrssc » Sun May 14, 2017 8:42 am

Have you looked at:a BBSP ?

https://www.midi-hardware.com/index.php?section=prod_info&product=BBSP&R2=USD

Altho you would need a master controller such as the MRG2, you would not have to configure a 4 X 8 matrix.

https://www.midi-hardware.com/index.php?section=prod_info&product=MRG2&R2=USD

Rgds,
Ed
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