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Dynamic Stop Labels - solved!

Building organ consoles for use with Hauptwerk, adding MIDI to existing consoles, obtaining parts, ...

Dynamic Stop Labels - solved!

Postby MikeDC » Sat Jul 01, 2017 3:02 am

It would appear that Viscount has solved the problem of dynamic stop labels that change when a new sample set is loaded. Apparently they are OLED and they are being introduced on Viscount's new "made for Hauptwerk" console.

So...who knows where we can get the technology they're using for the stop labels?

You can see a little of what they look like here:

http://www.viscountinstruments.it/organi-classici/hymmersive.html
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Re: Dynamic Stop Labels - solved!

Postby NickNelson » Sat Jul 01, 2017 3:38 am

Try searching 1.3" white oled on ebay - you'll find plenty I expect - tricky little devils to drive in my experience though.

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Re: Dynamic Stop Labels - solved!

Postby Grant_Youngman » Sat Jul 01, 2017 7:16 am

Midi Boutique offers what looks like a nice product based on electronic paper technology — in addition to the display it includes the MIDI controller, SAM/lamp drivers, and other necessary bits on the little display board. So it solves several problems at once if you're building a console.

http://midiboutique.com/MIDI-processors/estop
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Re: Dynamic Stop Labels - solved!

Postby johnstump_organist » Sat Jul 01, 2017 1:31 pm

While there are dynamic labeling options now, there are still some problems I see.
1) stop knobs/tabs are spread out fairly far apart to accommodate the displays
2) if you order your stop controls by division do you include enough stop controls to accommodataccommodate variations among sample sets? I.e. some sets might have 12 Great stops and 15 swell stops, others would be reverse.

If you had 4 manuals a pedals and put 20 stop controls for each to accommodate large sets, you would have 100 stops + possible couplers. Still your console might be able to conviently lay out all sample sets in a systematic/logical way.
I think touch screens will remain as the best solution for a while, unless you build a console to a specific sample set - then no need for dynamic labels.
My 2 pesos worth of thought,
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Re: Dynamic Stop Labels - solved!

Postby engrssc » Sat Jul 01, 2017 11:33 pm

Not dynamic, but very cost effective. You do need the "right" console build, tho.

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Re: Dynamic Stop Labels - solved!

Postby MikeDC » Sun Jul 02, 2017 2:39 pm

Grant_Youngman wrote:Midi Boutique offers what looks like a nice product based on electronic paper technology — in addition to the display it includes the MIDI controller, SAM/lamp drivers, and other necessary bits on the little display board. So it solves several problems at once if you're building a console.

http://midiboutique.com/MIDI-processors/estop



I love Midiboutique's products, but I think Jordan's displays are still too big and will lead the problem John is speaking of in his post, i.e., spacing of displays and switches. Whereas, Viscount's solution looks very compact (which also means small print, I know), but I think the spacing problem becomes less of an issue.

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Re: Dynamic Stop Labels - solved!

Postby organtechnology » Sun Jul 02, 2017 7:09 pm

MikeDC wrote:
Grant_Youngman wrote:Midi Boutique offers what looks like a nice product based on electronic paper technology — in addition to the display it includes the MIDI controller, SAM/lamp drivers, and other necessary bits on the little display board. So it solves several problems at once if you're building a console.

http://midiboutique.com/MIDI-processors/estop



I love Midiboutique's products, but I think Jordan's displays are still too big and will lead the problem John is speaking of in his post, i.e., spacing of displays and switches. Whereas, Viscount's solution looks very compact (which also means small print, I know), but I think the spacing problem becomes less of an issue.

Mike


Yes but Jordan's eStop is available now and I think if we could talk him into letting us turn the printing 90 degrees so that it sat long side vertical and built a switch into the mount so that a touch of the module provided the switch action it could be very compact and effective. Those OLEDs are TINY and not available to DIYers yet. Pluss the switch is external and doubles the area required.

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Re: Dynamic Stop Labels - solved!

Postby engrssc » Sun Jul 02, 2017 9:06 pm

Trying to picture how (or if) OLED's could be used with draw knobs. Tabs, yes.

I see many Arduino based OLED displays, but they are relatively too large.

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Re: Dynamic Stop Labels - solved!

Postby johnh » Mon Jul 03, 2017 3:16 pm

Round OLED displays are becoming available for the 'digital watch' industry. These would be a perfect solution for labelling drawknobs...
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Re: Dynamic Stop Labels - solved!

Postby engrssc » Mon Jul 03, 2017 8:07 pm

johnh wrote:Round OLED displays are becoming available for the 'digital watch' industry. These would be a perfect solution for labeling drawknobs...


Saw a piece on that. Wonder how the many needed wires would survive a moving SAM's drawknob?

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Re: Dynamic Stop Labels - solved!

Postby johnh » Mon Jul 03, 2017 11:05 pm

Electronics are getting cheap. A display and processor in each drawknob could be connected with just two wires, power and ground. A WiFi network could allow the drawknobs to communicate with the controller. Or just add one more wire for comm.
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Re: Dynamic Stop Labels - solved!

Postby NotStillEquipped » Thu Jan 04, 2018 10:23 am

Hello,

http://www.pausch-e.de/spieltische.htm

http://www.pausch-e.de/Beschriftungssystem.htm

By the way, I would want (I've searched and not found) to know how many Knobs (Tabs) / Displays are allowed in Hauptwerk.

Thanks, Francis
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Re: Dynamic Stop Labels - solved!

Postby mdyde » Thu Jan 04, 2018 10:58 am

NotStillEquipped wrote:By the way, I would want (I've searched and not found) to know how many Knobs (Tabs) / Displays are allowed in Hauptwerk.


Hello Francis,

Welcome to the forum.

The maximum number of LCDs that Hauptwerk can theoretically support is almost unlimited (many thousands), but it can address at most 16384 via any given MIDI OUT port. However, I believe that most (maybe all) available LCD panels only support 7-bit LCD panel IDs (instead of the full 14-bit LCD panel IDs that Hauptwerk allows), so in practice the limit would normally be 128 per MIDI OUT port. Also, MIDI is a fairly slow protocol, so it would probably be unwise (due to slow display refresh time) to drive a huge number of LCD panels from any given MIDI OUT port anyway. 32 (or maybe 64) LCD panels per dedicated MIDI OUT port would probably be reasonably acceptable in terms of refresh times (hopefully less than a second, depending on the speed of the LCD panel hardware's internal processing). (Hauptwerk can support hundreds of MIDI OUT ports.)

In summary, it's effectively unlimited, except by the number of MIDI OUT ports you have. There are MIDI interfaces with lots of MIDI OUT ports available from companies such as MOTU and iConnectivity:

http://motu.com/products/midi/128
https://www.iconnectivity.com/products/midi/mio10/
Best regards,
Martin.

[Please use email or the Contact page if you need to contact us privately, rather than private forum messages.]

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Re: Dynamic Stop Labels - solved!

Postby NotStillEquipped » Thu Jan 04, 2018 1:11 pm

Thanks, Martin,

My question were about the "St Sulpice" style console shown in the second link : this form is appreciated in Europe, but with banks like PAB Gravissimo, it's better to have an unlimited budget :P

The biggest console must be at St Vincent de Paul, Marseille, with 168 knobs installed and 16 waiting.

https://servimg.com/view/16954125/96

Best regards, Francis
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