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Mac vs. Win (probably a rehash - latest wisdom requested!)

Buying or building computers for Hauptwerk, recommendations, troubleshooting computer hardware issues.
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engrssc

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Re: Mac vs. Win (probably a rehash - latest wisdom requested

PostMon Feb 02, 2015 11:58 am

sonar11 wrote:As for the software: the Apple is tuned better, out of the box, for Hauptwerk type usage (audio / video work).


Well stated. My leaning toward (and recommending Mac) is for this reason esp to those who who are not computer pro's (and I don't consider myself to be in that class.) There definitely is a learning curve with H/W. As a result, whatever is available to lesson that "feature" seemingly is a benefit for Hauptwerk users. It makes Hauptwerk less daunting as far as the "end" result. Many would welcome an all inclusive turnkey system including computer, hardware and software. I can only make assumptions as to why such a product isn't available. There seems to be a never ending quest to improve one's setup beyond the initial state, which for some folks, makes H/W appear to be a musical hobbyist's "toy". Many of us don't see it that way.

Converting/midifying a console isn't beyond many person's abilities. Making it work and fine tuning it is another area of concern. I would venture to say, every time I check this Forum, I learn something new even after being with Hauptwerk since version 1.0.

Rgds,
Ed
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steve till

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Re: Mac vs. Win (probably a rehash - latest wisdom requested

PostMon Feb 02, 2015 11:56 pm

Well I don't know much about the reliability of a PC,
but I bought my first Mac in January 1986, so it's now 29.

Of course it doesn't run the latest OS, or HW.
But what it ran when it was newish, still runs.
All the old software is still there, and tons of
documents and even music.

I don't use it any more, it just sits there.
I don't have the heart to throw it out.

I wonder how many IBM PCs are still able to turn on?

...
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sonar11

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Re: Mac vs. Win (probably a rehash - latest wisdom requested

PostTue Feb 03, 2015 9:02 am

steve till wrote:Well I don't know much about the reliability of a PC,
but I bought my first Mac in January 1986, so it's now 29.

Of course it doesn't run the latest OS, or HW.
But what it ran when it was newish, still runs.
All the old software is still there, and tons of
documents and even music.

I don't use it any more, it just sits there.
I don't have the heart to throw it out.

I wonder how many IBM PCs are still able to turn on?

...


I've never understood this type of argument; you cannot in any way compare a product made by company X 30 years ago, with the "same" product released by company X 30 years later. It doesn't work that way. The engineers who made that product are probably no longer with the company, the finances / budget the company had to work with is probably different, the executives running the company are probably different people, and the market is probably different. Your 30 year old apple may as well have "ACME Widgets" written on the front of the box. :P
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engrssc

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Re: Mac vs. Win (probably a rehash - latest wisdom requested

PostWed Feb 04, 2015 1:49 pm

sonar11 wrote:I've never understood this type of argument; you cannot in any way compare a product made by company X 30 years ago, with the "same" product released by company X 30 years later.


Agree to some extent. However "I" think an important criteria, more relevant, is consistent quality/reliability over the course of that period of time, irregardless of the names of execs, engineers, assemblers, shipping clerks etc. It also amounts to how well a product can be adapted/suited to a specific end user target application.

I prefer Apple Macs for Hauptwerk because Mac's have built-in high quality audio features which work well with H/W. While H/W runs and runs well on both PC's and Mac's and without a bias, it comes down to preferences and costs. I've heard it "said" which is more valuable, in the USA, a quarter or twenty five cents? :roll:

Rgds,
Ed
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steve till

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Re: Mac vs. Win (probably a rehash - latest wisdom requested

PostThu Feb 05, 2015 12:22 am

Well of course twenty five cents is more valuable than a quarter.

After all, there are twenty five of them, vs. only one quarter.

And that's why I like Apples!
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amun

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Re: Mac vs. Win (probably a rehash - latest wisdom requested

PostThu Feb 05, 2015 2:54 am

steve till wrote:Well of course twenty five cents is more valuable than a quarter.

After all, there are twenty five of them, vs. only one quarter.

And that's why I like Apples!


A nice comparison: it seems to explain why Apple users, to make sure that they have really 25 cents, have to count them regularly and tell the world every day they still have them all together.

Not very seriously,
amun :wink:
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engrssc

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Re: Mac vs. Win (probably a rehash - latest wisdom requested

PostFri Feb 06, 2015 5:38 am

steve till wrote:Well of course twenty five cents is more valuable than a quarter.

After all, there are twenty five of them, vs. only one quarter.

And that's why I like Apples!


Not sure if this is wisdom (per the header of this post) or not, but check out this clip esp near the middle

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=jeUX4e1gBWU

Rgds,
Ed
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Antoni Scott

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Re: Mac vs. Win (probably a rehash - latest wisdom requested

PostSun Feb 08, 2015 3:40 pm

My guess would be to stick with a Mac. Initially my Mac was boot-camped with Windows 64 on a partitioned hard drive. I think it had an external sound card ( I didn't set it up) I never had a problem with it. When I built another Hauptwerk system I used a PC and had nothing but audio-glitch problems. I had several computer guru's look at it but the audio-glitches remained. If something is no good in the first place, you can't fix it to make it good. Anyway, I got a Mac mini and it was perfect "out of the box". I know a lot of Hauptwerk users use PC's but I think you have to know what audio internal components to use and specify that in your PC.

I don't know much of anything about computers and am confused by all the computer lingo which never really says anything bad about anything. If you are not sure about what system to use (Mac vs PC) and you are not 100% familiar with what you need, I would shy away from a PC.
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Re: Mac vs. Win (probably a rehash - latest wisdom requested

PostFri May 29, 2015 10:40 am

An earlier commentator mentioned that you might end up spending the same amoutn of money either way if you are going to buy similar PC components to those of Macs. They are probably right. Currently, only the (new) mac pro's are accepting 64gb. I can tell you I have a 27" imac with 32gb ram and I'm happy as a clam. I will caution you however- I believe the new "trashcan" pros have soldered ram so you have to order it the way you want it (I could be mistaken, it's been a while since I've looked at the specs). Imacs on the other hand have uuser removable ram. So, you can only order the base 16gb model and then order better ram from a 3rd party vendor and save yourself $400+ (I ordered ram from Crucial and saved a boatload and and am quite happy with it.)

Ultimately, if you plan on ordering the PAB and loading a computer with 64-128gb of ram you might want to go windows because it will be possible and easier to do a custom-configured machine to accommodate your needs. If I ever max out a machine just for hauptwerk that is what I would do. You just have to pay through the nose either way. Also, if you are going to be a big touchscreen user then macs might not be the best bet for you.
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Re: Mac vs. Win (probably a rehash - latest wisdom requested

PostFri May 29, 2015 12:23 pm

Ask Brett,
What Computer is being utilized by nearly every "Pro Recording Studio",
I am pretty sure he will tell us all the answer, I think his answer will be Mac ! :roll:
I will take his recommendation above all others,
and I am planing in the near future to replace my antique Hauptwerk Organ , PC.
Mel
Mel..............TheOrganDoc...............
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Re: Mac vs. Win (probably a rehash - latest wisdom requested

PostFri May 29, 2015 12:48 pm

I agree. I thought I was going to save money by using a PC but the trouble I had wasn't worth it. Brett is correct, the Mac is trouble free out of the box. I have a 2008 vintage MacPro, as my Hauptwerk computer. I have had to replace the RAM since several modules went bad. I also had the graphics card replaced (under warranty). It has eight cores and 32Gigs of RAM and plays all but my largest sample set.
I have been considering a "back-up" computer and I see some MacPro 12 core units on E-bay, fully refurbished. Sooner or later the time will come that I will have to get a new unit because the sample set requirements get larger and larger.
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Re: Mac vs. Win (probably a rehash - latest wisdom requested

PostSat May 30, 2015 12:00 am

I have had great success with my home-built 3930k-based (Intel 6 core i7) PC with now 64GB of RAM. It was put into service as a 32GB machine in October, 2012, and has since been upgraded to 64GB and two solid state drives. DDR3 memory has come down in price considerably since I bought the 32GB upgrade last fall, and I only regret not having bought the full 64GB when RAM was even less costly in the Fall of 2012. Coupled with the RME Fireface 800, it is rock solid with Hauptwerk, and 64GB of RAM allows me to load the full PAB Gravissimo at the highest quality settings.

Since I use this machine for software other than Hauptwerk for which a PC is required, a Mac was not an option. However, I have two Macs with less memory that I use for other purposes and absolutely love them. As noted by others, they are very stable machines with far fewer issues than PCs in general.

As far as cost goes, there is no question but that by building my PC I saved thousands of dollars over a comparably-configured Mac Pro. So from a cost-benefit analysis, for me the PC was the way to go for my higher-end Hauptwerk setup, even aside from the utility of being able to use it for other purposes as well. (I realize that a Mac can be boot-camped to run Windows, but that is a concept that troubles me as it would introduce Windows issues into the Mac universe in ways that I would prefer to avoid altogether. Why ruin a perfectly good Mac with Windows? :D )

Now, if I decided to dedicate a Mac to Hauptwerk (and perhaps the high-end video and photo applications I use), and had $6,000 burning a hole in my pocket, then I wouldn't hesitate to buy a fully-configured 64GB Mac Pro. And because I would still use the PC and FF 800 for other purposes, I would likely budget another $2,000 for an RME UFX interface. For now, however, I'll just have to make do with the PC alternative.
Stan Kartchner, Tucson, AZ USA
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RichardW

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Re: Mac vs. Win (probably a rehash - latest wisdom requested

PostSat May 30, 2015 6:24 am

If you are the kind of person who just wants the computer to work without much fuss and has a lot of money to spend then go for a Mac. It will be easier to get support for Hauptwerk if you use a Mac as well because the hardware will be well understood.

On the other hand, if you are happy messing about with hardware and are not totally fazed by driver updates, component incompatibilities and registry settings then you can save yourself a lot of money by going down the PC route. My 32GB PC cost something over £600 and runs all my sample sets without a problem. I could easily have spent a few thousand pounds on a Mac.

If my PC had the same standard of componenst as a Mac Pro then it would have cost me more but I decided that the "gold plating" was probably not necessary. Happily, that worked for me.

Regards,
Richard
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