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Speaker recommendations

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Re: Speaker recommendations

Postby dcaton » Mon Jan 30, 2017 4:26 pm

magnaton wrote:As you can see, you'll get lots of participation from the forum on this subject. :)

Like Sonar11, I too would recommend a multi-channel option. IMHO, when planning or implementing a multi-channel setup, you can get by with the less the expensive studio monitors. If given the choice of a pair of Def Tech Biploars at $2K or 8 Adam F5 active studio monitors, I'd pick the latter. Or better yet, 6 Adam F6s and add on decent subwoofer.

I have a good friend whose HW set up uses 12 channels the 8" Monoprice studio monitors. Sounds wonderful! Another audio forum strongly suggested these Monoprice monitors are made by M-Audio as the specs and even the dimensions were very close to their production version. They are only sold in pairs ($165), so $2K would give you 12 pairs (24 channels)!

Finally, if you feel that studio monitors are "not particularly attractive", check out this cool thread:
http://forum.hauptwerk.com/viewtopic.php?f=21&t=10333&p=76037


Danny B.

This is not going to be an easy choice, is it? I've never purchased anything from Monoprice, but the reviews seem to be pretty good. They don't have the ribbon tweeters that some here recommend, but I could always upgrade down the road.

They have a 25% discount so I could get 6 pairs of these for a bit over $900 incl. shipping. That seems hard to pass up. Their sub claims to go down to 20hz so perhaps I should get one or two of those as well... Don't have much time to decide, the 25% discount is today only.

MPiercey's setup has me salivating; thanks for the link. What a great idea. His console is very similar to mine and I have about the same amount of wall space. That would certainly address the ugly-monitor issue.
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Re: Speaker recommendations

Postby dw154515 » Mon Jan 30, 2017 4:54 pm

As the creator of the "Large Church Installation" thread, I can reiterate one thing that I already knew before making my first post....

Reading black and white text on the internet is incapable of helping one to understand something as subjective as audio quality.

Go have a listen. Try out speakers. LOTS AND LOTS of them. I've spent the better part of a year listening and even building lots of designs, and the best advice I have, is go listen. I still don't know what I'd prefer.

I used to sell HiFi and the question I HATED the most was, "well which one is best?" That is an impossible question because we all like such vastly different aesthetics.

As others have mentioned, it largely comes down to whether or not you're doing 2 channel or multi-channel.

At home, I use a pair of GoldenEar Triton II's, and I couldn't imagine doing a 2 channel setup on anything that doesn't have a powered sub. But the option of inexpensive studio monitors (in a multi-channel setup) in combination with a sub, is very likely the "ideal" home solution.

Why not start out with a pair (and a sub) and grow over time if money and space are the limiting factors?

I originally considered DefTech towers for my church build, but the inevitable cost of seperate amps drove the cost to astronomical heights.
Drew A. Worthen
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http://www.innovativeaudiovideosolutions.com
Master of Music in Composition - Butler University
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Director of Music - Greenwood UMC
http://www.greenwoodumcmusic.org
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Re: Speaker recommendations

Postby dw154515 » Mon Jan 30, 2017 5:00 pm

dcaton wrote:
sonar11 wrote:If you can wait for a bit, Emotiva is releasing their updated "Airmotiv" studio monitors, with an AMT tweeter, and these new versions come with grills.

Where did you find this info? I won't have a need for the speakers for 2-3 months, but as I said, keeping an eye out for good deals in the meantime.

sonar11 wrote:But really you're best bet is to listen to the speakers and make a choice after that, don't make a purchase based solely on which speaker is cheaper.

As a practical matter, how would you go about doing this? With traditional home audio, sure, but listening to a multi-speaker VPO setup at a store or showroom would be a real challenge.



Take your phone/laptop, etc. and go to organstops.org

Listen to the individual sample recordings under various stops. If one speaker makes you go, "Oh, I can hear the detail," BINGO! That's the one. Take 12+ of them, and it's just awesomeness on top of awesomeness.

Also, if you have a laptop, just get the demo version of HW and go plug it in at the store. Who cares if you get weird looks from the half-baked sales guys. You're about to build something way cooler than anyone in GuitarCenter or SAM Ash could have imagined! (Speaking from experience here!) :P
Drew A. Worthen
Innovative Audio Video Solutions - Owner
http://www.innovativeaudiovideosolutions.com
Master of Music in Composition - Butler University
http://www.drewworthen.com
Director of Music - Greenwood UMC
http://www.greenwoodumcmusic.org
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Re: Speaker recommendations

Postby dcaton » Mon Jan 30, 2017 5:20 pm

dw154515 wrote:Go have a listen. Try out speakers. LOTS AND LOTS of them. ... Why not start out with a pair (and a sub) and grow over time if money and space are the limiting factors?


Money to some extent is always a limiting factor, space isn't so much.

I completely understand that these things are subjective, but opinions are still useful as long as you're mindful that they are subjective. There's also build quality and other issues which are less subjective. I'm not asking "what's best" in the context of what sounds better, I guess I'm really looking for what type of installation is preferable, and perhaps if I should steer clear of any of the speakers I've mentioned because they're truly horrible.

It's somewhat impractical to go have a listen to speakers when your intended audio source is a VPO, isn't it? Assuming there's even a retailer in the area that has the things you're interested in, and was willing to set up an array of monitors and let you attach a computer with HW to try them out. Buying and returning things via Amazon, etc. can end up chewing up lots of $ in shipping costs.
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Re: Speaker recommendations

Postby dcaton » Mon Jan 30, 2017 5:29 pm

dw154515 wrote:Also, if you have a laptop, just get the demo version of HW and go plug it in at the store. Who cares if you get weird looks from the half-baked sales guys. You're about to build something way cooler than anyone in GuitarCenter or SAM Ash could have imagined! (Speaking from experience here!) :P

I do. That's an interesting idea 8) I'm tempted to try the Monoprice monitors though, the price is hard to beat and I do have to save some money for midi boards, etc.. Could always sell them on eBay or Craigslist if/when I decide to upgrade to something else.
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Re: Speaker recommendations

Postby magnaton » Mon Jan 30, 2017 6:32 pm

dcaton wrote:They have a 25% discount so I could get 6 pairs of these for a bit over $900 incl. shipping. That seems hard to pass up. Their sub claims to go down to 20hz so perhaps I should get one or two of those as well... Don't have much time to decide, the 25% discount is today only.


They run other sales from time to time on certain items including the studio monitors along with site-wide sales but its usually 15%. Today is a rare 25% off. Also, I can highly recommend their TRS audio cables too. Excellent quality! I'm guessing you have an audio interface that uses TRS or XLR cables for output? Keep their cables in mind regardless of what direction you take.

Unfortunately I've read some not so good reviews on their 10", 200watt sub from on other audiophile forms. I've never heard one personally to comment either way. Subwoofers may warrant a different thread. If you want to reproduce the sound of a 32' pipe (16Hz), then check out the subwoofer offerings from SVS or Rythmik Audio. Also search the forum for past subwoofer discussions.

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Re: Speaker recommendations

Postby dcaton » Mon Jan 30, 2017 7:00 pm

magnaton wrote:
dcaton wrote:They have a 25% discount so I could get 6 pairs of these for a bit over $900 incl. shipping. That seems hard to pass up. Their sub claims to go down to 20hz so perhaps I should get one or two of those as well... Don't have much time to decide, the 25% discount is today only.


They run other sales from time to time on certain items including the studio monitors along with site-wide sales but its usually 15%. Today is a rare 25% off. Also, I can highly recommend their TRS audio cables too. Excellent quality! I'm guessing you have an audio interface that uses TRS or XLR cables for output? Keep their cables in mind regardless of what direction you take.

Unfortunately I've read some not so good reviews on their 10", 200watt sub from on other audiophile forms. I've never heard one personally to comment either way. Subwoofers may warrant a different thread. If you want to reproduce the sound of a 32' pipe (16Hz), then check out the subwoofer offerings from SVS or Rythmik Audio. Also search the forum for past subwoofer discussions.

Danny B.

I don't have an interface yet (except the on-board one), am considering the Motu Ultralite-MK3. I ran across the Rythmik subs earlier today, look very interesting. Think I'll skip the Monoprice subs, two of the reviews said it doesn't go below 32hz despite the specs.
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Re: Speaker recommendations

Postby magnaton » Mon Jan 30, 2017 8:34 pm

dcaton wrote:It's somewhat impractical to go have a listen to speakers when your intended audio source is a VPO, isn't it? Assuming there's even a retailer in the area that has the things you're interested in, and was willing to set up an array of monitors and let you attach a computer with HW to try them out. Buying and returning things via Amazon, etc. can end up chewing up lots of $ in shipping costs.


You don't have to go that far as actually hearing an array of speakers. As Drew suggested, start with auditioning and comparing stereo pairs. Guitar Center, Sam Ashe, or your local music retailer should have a studio or recording department where you can hear the various studio monitor brands with or without a subwoofer. Something akin to this:
https://www.yelp.com/biz_photos/guitar-center-northridge?select=xx-huLK7a_LPw4pP8WkbEQ

Just know that if your happy with the sound from that particular stereo pair, it just gets better and better as you continue to add more pairs. Sorry, I'm basically repeating Drew's response :oops:

From reading this forum for the last 2.5 years and reviewing pictures of Hauptwerk setups here and on the pcrogan forums, I compiled a short list (from memory) of active studio monitors used in multiplies for Hauptwerk. This might assist to help in narrowing your choice selection a bit.
- Behringer 2031A
- PreSonus Eris E8 and E5 models
- JBL LSR 305 and 308 models
- Mackie MR8 mk3 and MR5 mk3 models
- M-Audio Bx8 and Bx5 models

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Re: Speaker recommendations

Postby dcaton » Mon Jan 30, 2017 11:19 pm

magnaton wrote:This might assist to help in narrowing your choice selection a bit.
- Behringer 2031A
- PreSonus Eris E8 and E5 models
- JBL LSR 305 and 308 models
- Mackie MR8 mk3 and MR5 mk3 models
- M-Audio Bx8 and Bx5 models

Thanks. I decided to go with the Monoprice 8" monitors. The 25% off code is only good today, and at $123 a pair I think it's a no-brainer to at least give them a try. If/when I decide to upgrade down the road, I can probably sell them on Ebay or Craigslist and recoup most of what I paid. If the sale price wasn't today only, I'd find some time to do as you and others have suggested and torment the sales people at the local Guitar Center. I'll probably do that down the road but for now I have something to start with.
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Re: Speaker recommendations

Postby magnaton » Tue Jan 31, 2017 12:03 am

Cool! Be sure to update this thread when you've had a chance to really test drive them. We'd value your opinion.

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Re: Speaker recommendations

Postby dcaton » Tue Jan 31, 2017 1:31 pm

Perhaps I should start a new thread (in a different section ?), but now I have to decide on an audio interface. I bought 6 pairs of the MonoPrice monitors and I'll eventually get a sub so I'll need at least 13 outputs plus a headphone out.

I was thinking about the ESI Gigaport HD+, but it only has 8 outputs and you can't use more than one. Most of the interfaces out there with lots of outputs also have lots of inputs (and often more ins than outs), which seems like a waste of money. Ideally I'd like an interface that allows multiples to be used for future expansion without having to buy a lot more than I need right now.

The MOTU 24Ao is interesting but a little overkill, and approaching the cost of a mortgage payment.

Suggestions anyone?
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Re: Speaker recommendations

Postby mstng67 » Tue Jan 31, 2017 2:16 pm

I got the Cymatic LP-16 to replace my audio interface.
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Re: Speaker recommendations

Postby magnaton » Tue Jan 31, 2017 3:24 pm

mstng67 wrote:I got the Cymatic LP-16 to replace my audio interface.


Here is a nice review from Contrebombarde on this unit.
http://www.contrebombarde.com/concerthall/home/view_cat/cat/7/sort/68/order/last_modified/limit/10

Note the outputs are unbalanced (TS) vs balanced (TRS) from other makes such as RME, Motu, Focusrite, etc, to name the popular brands used with HW.

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Re: Speaker recommendations

Postby mstng67 » Tue Jan 31, 2017 3:54 pm

That is the only drawback to the unit, but my 12 channel amp is right next to it so the run is not far.
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Re: Speaker recommendations

Postby dcaton » Tue Jan 31, 2017 5:12 pm

mstng67 wrote:That is the only drawback to the unit, but my 12 channel amp is right next to it so the run is not far.

I was planning on using one or two pairs of monitors for the antiphonal division. From the console up the wall into the attic, across to the back of the room and back down will probably require ~50' cables. Wonder if that's too far for non-balanced connections. Otherwise, the LP-16 looks like a good deal. The (very few) other options I've found so far are at least 2x the cost.

Too bad someone doesn't make something geared for VPOs, but I suppose the market is too small.
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