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Multi-Channel Routing

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SKresge

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Multi-Channel Routing

PostSat Mar 26, 2022 9:01 am

I started a multi-channel system (16 channels – 8 in front and 8 in back with a pair of sub woofers on another channel) with HW 4.2 and was able at the time to set up divisions to go to certain channels with a complete mix down of 16’ pipes to the subwoofers (I believe I used the paramount example at the time). With subsequent upgrades (5, 6, and now 7) I just let the system stay the same and didn’t change anything with the audio/mixer/routing, etc. Mainly because I didn’t understand it as was the case with many when these changes started. I have since watched some great videos by Jerry and Drew, etc. and think I have grasped the entire audio flow. I still want some of the older sample sets to be routed by division and some of the newer sets like, Nitra, was thinking about trying to route the directional (front, middle and rear) for more of a surround sound experience.

When I bring up different dialogue boxes to do this, of course there is nothing named, assigned, etc. I am assuming I follow the directions and start naming the speakers/channels in the audio Device and channels dialogue and setting up the master mix buses (to include the subwoofers) and just make sure it is routed the way I had it for the older sample sets, in the Audio Mixer Dialogue setting the mixer preset to the correct output perspective. My biggest question is the mix down to the pair of subs I have. No one addressed this specifically in the videos I watched and was wondering if this is done in the bass part of rank in the Rank Routing to Audio Mixer (primary) Bus Groups dialogue box.

And for setting up the newer surround sound sets, like Nitra, I am assuming once I get the labeling and the bus routing set up, I just route the front, middle and rear ranks via the Rank Routing Dialogue box how I want them to go.

Also, with the advent of mixer presets, can you set up divisional routing with one and then the surround sound with another and just switch back and forth between the two by changing the mixer preset from the Audio Mixer, routing and voicing dialog?

Hope this makes sense, after writing this all done, not sure if I do understand it . . .

Scott
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IainStinson

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Re: Multi-Channel Routing

PostSat Mar 26, 2022 10:06 am

Subwoofers
I only have one subwoofer. I feed it with a full mixdown of all the the other outputs (but not from any convolution reverb generated). The subwoofer speaker and amp only respond to the low frequencies (and this can be set by adjusting the cut-off frequency on the subwoofer unit). I think this works well.

For pipes where the fundamental frequency of the note being played is within the range of the subwoofer, (usually 16ft and lower stops) also include harmonics above the frequency range of the subwoofer and to hear these they must be assigned to sound through speakers which reproduce these frequencies. if you only send the output from these pipes/stops to a sub woofer, then these higher frequencies, which are important in reproducing the timbre of the pipes, would be lost.

If I had more than one subwoofer:
    a. I might try using one for the full left and one for the full right mixdown.
    b. I would consider using one with the front and one with the rear perspective.
    c. If I divided the speakers by division, I would assign one to each of the groups of speakers used for the division and I would still (at least to start with) send each sub a full mix down of that divisions output
Iain
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mdyde

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Re: Multi-Channel Routing

PostSat Mar 26, 2022 10:37 am

Hello Scott,

To add to Iain's reply, if you haven't already done so, have a good read through the "Audio routing and impulse response reverb part 2 (Advanced Edition only): multi-channel audio, ... and routing concepts for advanced use" section in the main Hauptwerk user guide (pages 216-226 in the current v7.0.0 version). That explains the key concepts in depth, i.e. in particular that ranks are routed to groups, and groups contain one or more mixer buses (which may have device channels channels selected for them).

Also have a read through the "Example 4: multi-channel audio with 8 (or more) speakers configured as stereo pairs in 4 groups of 1 pair each, with different organ divisions routed to different groups, optionally plus a sub-woofer ..." sub-section (pages 233-238). As covered there, you would normally use one of the mixer's 'master mix' buses (on the Audio Mixer screen) for your subwoofer, and there's actually one preconfigured for that purpose, with all sending audio to it by default (as 'aux sends' did in v4). The 'master mix' buses are just like 'aux mix-down outputs' in v4, in that other (primary) buses can send/mix audio to them. There's nothing stopping you from using two of the master mix buses for your two sub-woofers.

Mixer presets are complete sets of mixer buses and groups, so that you could, for example,:

- Set up mixer preset 3 to use for the organs for which you wish to use different speakers for different divisions (as in the above 'example 4' sub-section in the user guide, and as you're doing currently).

- Set up mixer preset 4 to use for the organs that you wish to route 'by surround perspective'.

... then select the appropriate one of those two presets for each of your organs.

SKresge wrote:Also, with the advent of mixer presets, can you set up divisional routing with one and then the surround sound with another and just switch back and forth between the two by changing the mixer preset from the Audio Mixer, routing and voicing dialog?


You can select any mixer preset for any organ, and you can change that selection in real-time. However, settings on the "Organ settings | Rank voicing ..." and the "Organ settings | Rank routing ..." screen aren't per-mixer-preset, so if you change an organ's mixer preset then you would potentially need to reconfigure the ranks on those two screens, so that they're appropriate for the mixer preset that you've now chosen for the organ.

For example, if on the "Organ settings | Rank voicing ..." screen you had selected bus group 0025 as the destination for a particular rank when you had mixer preset 3 selected for the organ, and you then instead selected mixer preset 4 for that organ, that particular rank would then be routed to mixer preset 4's group 0025, instead of mixer preset 3's group 0025.

(We hope to add the ability to define 'rank voicing/routing presets' in the future, so that you can switch those things too in real-time.)
Best regards, Martin.
Hauptwerk software designer/developer, Milan Digital Audio.
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SKresge

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Re: Multi-Channel Routing

PostSat Mar 26, 2022 11:48 am

mdyde wrote:if you haven't already done so, have a good read through the "Audio routing and impulse response reverb part 2 (Advanced Edition only): multi-channel audio, ... and routing concepts for advanced use" section in the main Hauptwerk user guide (pages 216-226 in the current v7.0.0 version). That explains the key concepts in depth, i.e. in particular that ranks are routed to groups, and groups contain one or more mixer buses (which may have device channels channels selected for them).

Also have a read through the "Example 4: multi-channel audio with 8 (or more) speakers configured as stereo pairs in 4 groups of 1 pair each, with different organ divisions routed to different groups, optionally plus a sub-woofer ..." sub-section (pages 233-238). As covered there, you would normally use one of the mixer's 'master mix' buses (on the Audio Mixer screen) for your subwoofer, and there's actually one preconfigured for that purpose, with all sending audio to it by default (as 'aux sends' did in v4). The 'master mix' buses are just like 'aux mix-down outputs' in v4, in that other (primary) buses can send/mix audio to them. There's nothing stopping you from using two of the master mix buses for your two sub-woofers.


Martin, I did read through them prior to watching all the videos. I have to admit they make more sense to me now. So it looks like having the master mix bus for the subwoofers will automatically route all the lower ranks for the divisions to the subwoofers and I have to do nothing special, correct?

It will take some time, but between the videos, the manual and your response, I think am on the right track.

Thanks as always for being so helpful!

Scott
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mdyde

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Re: Multi-Channel Routing

PostSat Mar 26, 2022 1:43 pm

Thanks, Scott. You're very welcome.

SKresge wrote:So it looks like having the master mix bus for the subwoofers will automatically route all the lower ranks for the divisions to the subwoofers and I have to do nothing special, correct?


Ranks get routed via groups to primary mixer buses. On the "General settings | Audio Mixer" screen, for any given primary bus, you can enable/disable sends to any of the eight master mix buses [and/or any of the eight intermediate mix buses] near the bottom of the right-hand pane. (You might need to scroll the right-hand pane down a bit to see the sends.)

Hence as long your primary buses have the relevant master mix bus ticked as a send [e.g. "Sends: to master mix buses: 3 'Stereo mix 3 (sub-woofer)'] then those primary buses will also mix down to that master mix bus. The send to master mix bus 3 is ticked by default anyway and named '... sub-woofer' by default, for convenience, but you could instead use a different master mix bus, or one of the intermediate mix buses, if you prefer.

(The master mix buses and intermediate mix buses are akin to the aux mix-down outputs in v4.)
Best regards, Martin.
Hauptwerk software designer/developer, Milan Digital Audio.
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dw154515

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Re: Multi-Channel Routing

PostSun Mar 27, 2022 3:25 pm

Hey, Scott. I'm glad the video was helpful. A lot of people contact me about this exact topic. I've thought about making a Part 2 of that video, addressing some of these concerns - such as the "split bass" part of the rank, sub crossovers, etc.

In essence, in 99% of situations, it makes the most sense to ignore the split bass option, and just feed the entire mixdown of whatever rank(s) to the sub and set the crossover on your sub appropriately - somewhere near the low end of where your main channels start to "roll off."

If you have multiple subs, I recommend doing something along the lines of creating a mixdown of ONLY the 32' ranks to one sub, and then all the 16' to the other. Your main audio channels should have no problem handling the 8' and up ranks on their own, without the sub. This requires utilizing those sub mixdowns and outputs to be MONO rather than stereo. The mono outputs are found further down the dropdown list of available output channels.

This should do you just fine in most situations. If you wanted to distribute things a little more "evenly," especially if you're doing theater organ stuff with a decent amount of 16' tone, you might use one sub for 32' AND 16' REEDS, and use the other sub for 16' FLUES only. Something like that would probably do you just fine.

If you ever have questions, feel free to email me through my website. I see those messages much quicker than I see them here on the forum.

Drew
Drew A. Worthen
Master of Music in Composition - Butler University
http://www.drewworthen.com
Director of Music & Website Admin - Greenwood UMC
http://www.greenwoodumc.org
Design Engineer - American Sound and Electronics - Indy
https://americansound.cc/

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