Def Tech 450s and their sound in a small room

For my Hauptwerk setup, (using Velesovo and Caen sample sets) I have 6 Def Tec 450s and a Supercube II in a middle-sized bedroom on the 3d floor of my city rowhouse. I also have AKG headphones.

I'm not a techy when it comes to "voicing," and have only messed around with increasing or decreasing the amplitude of discreet notes, usually in the pedals, when they "sound" louder or softer than the others in a particula rank.

But, I have a question about the type of overall sound of my Def Tech speakers and how they compare to the sound of the organ in the headphones. I know everyone says headphones sounds better than speakers; however, I really hear a pronounced mid-range in my Def Techs, and the upper end frequencies are not as "crisp" or "bright" as what I hear in the phones. From a non-technical point of view, is there anything I can do to make the speakers sound "brighter", especially in the upper range of frequencies" to make it come closer to what I hear in my headphones. Everyone recommended the Def Techs when I made my Hauptwerk purchase. I know they're good speakers, but somehow I'm a little disappointed when I'm playing the organ with speakers in this room, primarily because the sound seems predominantly in the mid-range. Is speaker placement possibly the answer? I have them at ear-level in each corner of the room.

Or is the answer simply that speakers, even quality speakers, don't sound near as good as the headphones.

The answer, sadly, is that modest size domestic rooms with typical furnishings are far from any acoustic ideal, and will typically dominate the sound whatever speaker you have. Failing the possibility of serious acoustic treatment, placement is about the only option you have to play with. Electronic correction can help for a single defined listening position, but should be applied with caution if listening in a wider area is expected. In domestic rooms, the lowest frequencies are uncertain at best, because the room is less than even a single wavelength in size; mid-bass frequencies can be very uneven, with standing waves forming because the dimensions are a small number of wavelengths in size - when a standing wave forms, there will be places where the sound at that frequency cancels out, and others where it appears reinforced.

Your mid-range predominance may be partly because of this, and this may vary with listening position or speaker position. These positions are complementary, so putting a speaker at the intended listening position and finding the places it sounds best may define the best places to put the speakers for best sound at the listening position.

Paul

I have increased the "brightness" setting on a number of my stops. This really brings out their beauty, but it also increases the intensity of the fast beats of thirds etc., so I need to find a happy medium.

When I first got the Velesovo demo it sounded very smooth to me, more so than the Kampen. But after playing the less than full principal chorus, I found it really sounded dull. I then turned up the brightness on the stops bringing out their individual beauty, but also found then it sounded more like the Kampen again hearing more of the fast beats. So I finally came to the conclusion that having the individual stops brightened up to sound absolutely clear and lovely, makes the organ more harsh as the stops build.

Fortunately since my recent sinus surgery, I really think the organ sounds much better, without the fast beats bothering me nearly so much. Before that I had alot of inner ear pressure, etc. that really messed with my hearing, in addition to congestion.

Also since having the full Kampen set loaded, there are so many combination possibilities, that I can find many really lovely combinations that sound extra good to me. This is only one way where HW really excels. With my real pipe organ I was so limited, and basically stuck with the "sound" the pipes produced, not to mention the lack of the lovely acoustics (reverb) wet sets give. That's what really "makes" the organ in my opinion.

I remember playing organ CD's just wishing I could have that sound. They made my pipe organ actually sound unattractive to play due to the dry sound, even with the 1 second or so native reverb of my room. Obviously I'm addicted to a large acoustic. I know there are some on this list that really prefer a dry sound.

Eric

I hate to bring up a sensitive subject but when I noticed the brightness of the mixtures going down it was a symptom of my ears going bad. Too much tuning as a youngster.

Jim,
I see your post here is about a month old so hopefully you will see this. I have done extensive testing with a much lower budget sound system than yours and here's a couple of things I would try that could make a huge difference. Yes, moving the speakers around can make a very big difference. How high off the floor, closer or further away from the wall, how they're pointed, where they are in relation to the console etc., etc., can all make very noticeable changes but this by itself will probably not do enough. If you are still lacking those nice clean highs you desire after some moving around of speakers, here's what I would do. 1.) Go out and pick up a pair of good quality satellite (smaller) speakers meant mainly for the upper / higher frequencies and if possible you really should listen to them and others in the store for comparisons first before you make your purchase. Connect them to your front channel and place them in front of you nearly together and centered to the front (back side of console closest to the wall) of the console at top of console height so you can just see them as you are sitting and experiment with moving them further apart off to the sides. You may even find pointing them upwards (what I did) will work nicely as the sound will deflect off the ceiling somewhat smoothing the highs and creating a nice additional dimensional effect depending on your ceiling height and surface. 2.) I have posted info earlier on this item and wonder if anyone else has even tried this or knows about this. Go out and pick up a BBE Sonic Maximizer (you can read up about them on the internet), this is a low cost high quality sound processor worth it's weight in gold (no, they're not just for heavy metal guitarists and no they're not just a 2 knob EQ) that can make a HUGE difference to ANY sound system no matter the brand or cost. I purchased one about a year ago and I wouldn't even think of going without it now. Run the BBE on the front channels with you new satellite speakers AND your current speakers, don't use it just with the satellites as you will not fully realize the benefits of this sound processor. You don't need it for the back speakers, just the front ones. You may even want to try this before a speaker purchase and for much less than $200 you really can't go wrong and should be much happier no matter what. If you or any others reading this have questions on this, feel free to ask. I'm always happy to talk audio and share ideas.

Marc