Loud static crashes on organ load

I'm currently evaluating the trial version and have experienced some issues that I would like to see if someone can assist me with. Occasionally when a organ is loaded or when loading a stand-by organ there is a deafening static crash of several seconds (so much so that I've turned off the organ because I'm afraid it will blow the speakers). It's not consistently happening but it does happen enough to cause me concern. I am hoping to post my problem and determine what might be the cause. I'm reluctant to purchase the licensed version until I can better understand what might be happening.

[mdyde]

Hello Jwfl,

Many thanks for the interest in Hauptwerk.

It's probably quickest if you could send us a diagnostic file ('File | Create diagnostic file ...'):

http://www.hauptwerk.com/forms/support-ticket/

... so that we can see you computer specs, audio/MIDI interfaces and their driver types, etc.

Please also let us know at what point during loading you hear the static noises. Is the progress indicator visible on the screen at the time?

Thanks, I've submitted the file.

Aside from the problem you mention, it is a good idea to leave the power amplifier(s) off until the organ is completely loaded. There are several methods from automatic to completely manual to do this. I have recommended the use of an industrial type sequencer (also known as programmable controllers) to do that task such as these http://www.factorymation.com/s.nl/sc.2/category.42/.f which use a simple ladder (diagram) program with *control) relay outputs. The (control) output relays are low current devices that, in practice, operate larger current capable relays which do the "heavy lifting", meaning, controlling the power amps. In my case, in addition, the sequencer also starts and shuts down the computer making for a single switch (on the console) to operate everything.

Rgds,
Ed

[mdyde]

Hello Jeff,

Thanks for the diagnostic file. Just for our reference, here are the relevant excerpts from your log describing your hardware, sample set and free memory:

2010-12-10-14-32-24: INF:4165 Welcome to Hauptwerk.

Hauptwerk version: 3.30.
Build: 005.
License type: Free Edition.
Configuration: Stand-alone.
Processor build type: Intel Core/Core 2, 32-bit.
Platform: Apple Mac OS X.
Operating system: OS X version above 10.5.8 or above 10.6.1 (Darwin version: 10.5.0).
Number of available CPU cores: 2.
Processor has Intel HyperThreading enabled: N.
Total installed physical memory reported by operating system: 3072 MB.
Current page file size reported by operating system (Windows PCs only): 0 MB.
Very approximate estimate of total physical memory currently free/usable: 1846 MB.
CPU speed: 2160 MHz.
CPU/computer type: MacBookPro2,2 (Intel Mac).
Executable folder: /Applications/Hauptwerk/HauptwerkApplication/Executable-StandAlone.
File locations folder: /Applications/Hauptwerk/HauptwerkApplication.
Application folder: /Applications/Hauptwerk/HauptwerkApplication.
User data folder: /Hauptwerk/HauptwerkUserData.
Sample set data folder: /Hauptwerk/HauptwerkSampleSetsAndComponents.
Temporary files folder: /Hauptwerk/HauptwerkInternalWorkingFiles.
MIDI input ports present: 'USB Uno MIDI Interface'.
MIDI output ports present: 'USB Uno MIDI Interface'.
Audio drivers present and number of output channels each provides: 'M-Audio Fast Track' (2), 'Built-in Output' (2). [ACT:4001 Initializing Hauptwerk.]

2010-12-10-12-59-35: INF:2157 The organ HaverhillOldIndependentChurch-Evaluation-HWFree.Organ.Hauptwerk.hbx has been loaded successfully. Metrics:

Organ ID: 000958.
Internal diagnostic code: 01000000.
Memory usage: very approximate estimate of total physical memory currently free/usable: 1130.73 MB.
Memory usage: very approximate estimate of sample and object memory currently in use by Hauptwerk (not including other data): 708.20 MB.
Memory usage: total memory used for raw sample set audio/tremulant sample data (not including pre-processed audio data, images, or other data): 619.52 MB.
Memory usage: overall compression ratio achieved for all ranks for which memory compression enabled: 43.27 percent.

2010-12-10-12-59-36: INF:2504 Starting audio and MIDI systems. [ACT:2401 Activating Hauptwerk.]

2010-12-10-12-59-36: INF:3825 Stopping MIDI input port 'USB Uno MIDI Interface' (device number 0). [ACT:3704 Stopping the MIDI system.]

2010-12-10-12-59-36: INF:5120 Starting audio output device 'M-Audio Fast Track'. [ACT:5003 Starting the audio system.]

2010-12-10-12-59-36: INF:3823 Starting MIDI input port 'USB Uno MIDI Interface' (device number 0). [ACT:3703 Starting the MIDI system.]

2010-12-10-12-59-36: INF:5197 Audio device ID 000001 started successfully using CoreAudio device 'M-Audio Fast Track' at 48000 Hz with a default stream resolution of 32 bits (stream format ID: 19), 2 channels, a buffer size of 1024 sample frames and an overall Hauptwerk audio output latency of 1094 sample frames. (Please note that some drivers do not report their latency correctly, and a reported latency of 88200 frames or more should be ignored.) [ACT:5003 Starting the audio system.]

2010-12-10-12-59-36: INF:5121 Started audio output device 'M-Audio Fast Track' successfully. [ACT:5003 Starting the audio system.]

2010-12-10-12-59-36: INF:2505 Audio and MIDI systems started successfully. Number of audio outputs: 1. Number of audio output groups: 1. Effective polyphony limit: 256. Output level adjustment: -10.0 dB. Enabled audio engine options: interpolation: Y, optimize for polyphony: Y, wind supply model: Y, swell box filters: Y, harmonic-shaping filters: Y, voicing filters: Y, keep memory active: Y. [ACT:2401 Activating Hauptwerk.]

I can't see anything indicative of a problem in your logs - your computer sounds fine (older MacBookPro 2.1 GHz, 3 GB memory, OS X 10.6.5) and the sample set you're using easily fits into the free memory you have available.

I suspect it might somehow be an issue with the M-Audio Fast Track device you're using, or perhaps the audio cabling or amplifiers.

Is this the audio interface you're using (USB)?:

http://www.m-audio.com/products/en_us/FastTrack.html

We haven't specifically tested with the Fast Track, but I'm not aware of any issues with it.

Can you also let us know the answer to my previous question?:

Please also let us know at what point during loading you hear the static noises. Is the progress indicator visible on the screen at the time?

Does changing the USB lead or moving the Fast Track to a different USB port solve the issue?

Do you get the same issue if you temporarily switch to using the MacBook Pro's built-in audio output instead?

How about if you use headphones plugged directly into its built-in output?

This appears to be the "latest" model of the audio interface but yes that's it (I went to that because of poor mini-headpones to RCA splitters). The problem seems to occur very sporadically, I played with it last night and no issues whatsoever. I've checked the connections, cables, etc. and I would tend to agree the USB audio does seem to be awfully sensitive. My Rodgers console at home has internal amps so there's not an opportunity to delay turning things on, etc as one suggested.

It seems to occur when the organ first begins to load and no status bar has appeared yet, the crash is deafening but does go away and the organ loads fine. I forgot to mention this had occurred on our 955 at church using the same configuration (imagine the static via 1200 watts into the sanctuary!). I'm beginning to wonder if it's something with the audio on the laptop itself. I do have a MacPro Quad Xeon that I will try to see if I have the same issue - again which is sporadic.

If there are other ideas on connecting the audio from the computer to the organ (Rodgers has stereo inputs with an adjustable level - i usually set to about 3/4) I'm certainly open to suggestions.

And to respond to the other questions...

Does changing the USB lead or moving the Fast Track to a different USB port solve the issue? No, I have tried via a hub as well as directly to the laptop and it's happened in both instances.

Do you get the same issue if you temporarily switch to using the MacBook Pro's built-in audio output instead? I have had it occur when using the splitters with the MacBook's internal audio, thought they were the culprit and went to the M-Audio device.

How about if you use headphones plugged directly into its built-in output? Haven't tried that yet but will certainly give it a try.

[mdyde]

Thanks, Jeff.

It seems to occur when the organ first begins to load and no status bar has appeared yet, the crash is deafening but does go away and the organ loads fine.

Was a previous organ loaded at that point? If not, then Hauptwerk wouldn't even have the audio drivers running (i.e. Hauptwerk wouldn't be producing any audio output), so it can't be any audio driver issue or issue with Hauptwerk directly. Perhaps some sort of electrical interference issue as a result of the hard-drive activity?

That's possible - it has occurred however when switching from one standby organ to another - I'm going to move the MacPro into the music room and give it a whirl - I'm sure the software will love the 5 GB and the faster procs. BTW - Just placed my order for the basic and the Haverhill!

[mdyde]

Thanks for the order!

Thanks for everyone's ideas... I am beginning to believe that it's related to cabling and possibly how the line in on the Rodgers is set up. I've tried going to an external amplifier and have not had the problem after trying to load and use several sample sets in succession. I am also going to begin using the optical output on the MacBook Pro to the amp and eliminate the M-audio box as well.

[mdyde]

Hello Jeff,

Thanks for the update. Good luck!

Just an FYI, I'm using an M-audio Fast Track Pro, and have found that I need to reduce the audio output to about -38 to prevent digital overload and distortion. Don't know if this has any bearing on your issue or not.

Thanks for that information, I do beleive it was either related to the cabling or the M-audio box. I elminated both and have gone to the optical output from the MacBook Pro to an external amplifier - the sound is much cleaner (yes I really could tell a difference) and believe the problem to be solved.