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HW 4 - Reverb using REAPER or BIDULE

Connecting Hauptwerk to MIDI organs, sequencers, ...

Re: HW 4 - Reverb using REAPER or BIDULE

Postby pwhodges » Thu Sep 15, 2011 10:49 am

SIR2 has zero latency itself (one of the improvements from the free v1). However, I don't know about latency in the HW VST link...

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Re: HW 4 - Reverb using REAPER or BIDULE

Postby mdyde » Thu Sep 15, 2011 11:17 am

Hello Paul,

Hauptwerk and the VST Link shouldn't add any latency above that of the VST host and its plug-ins. I.e. Hauptwerk fills each audio buffer (timeslice) immediately when the VST host asks it to.

Greg - impulse response files sometimes have latency within them. If different impulse responses give different latency then the impulse response file is the culprit.
Best regards,
Martin.

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Re: HW 4 - Reverb using REAPER or BIDULE

Postby Grant_Youngman » Thu Sep 15, 2011 11:32 am

amateurorganist wrote:I have Reaper and using SIR2 (demo) to drive the York Minster reverb thing. I know some real pipe organs have a slight lag but this has quite a lot of latency, enough to put me off playing properly. How do I cut that down? I have set the Hauptwerk latency thing as low as I can (1024, I think). How do I improve the lag in SIR/Reaper?


Sounds like you're seeing the same issue I did. Go into Reaper Preferences --> Audio --> Buffering. Turn OFF (uncheck) "Anticipative FX Processing". That solved the problem for me.
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Re: HW 4 - Reverb using REAPER or BIDULE

Postby amateurorganist » Fri Sep 16, 2011 2:28 pm

Grant_Youngman wrote:
amateurorganist wrote:I have Reaper and using SIR2 (demo) to drive the York Minster reverb thing. I know some real pipe organs have a slight lag but this has quite a lot of latency, enough to put me off playing properly. How do I cut that down? I have set the Hauptwerk latency thing as low as I can (1024, I think). How do I improve the lag in SIR/Reaper?


Sounds like you're seeing the same issue I did. Go into Reaper Preferences --> Audio --> Buffering. Turn OFF (uncheck) "Anticipative FX Processing". That solved the problem for me.


Hi Grant. Thank-you for that suggestion. I have tried it and it made a little difference. I bought the license for Sir2 this afternoon and fiddling with the settings there made no difference, disappointingly.

Why do IR have latency built into them? I having been using the York Minster & St. Alban's freebies and they both stop me from playing comfortably but the sound is really amazing. The Haverhill IOC extended set sounds out of this world!

1) Can anyone suggest any good IRs (free or paid) without latency worth getting?

2) I was reading on the Sonus Paradisi IR pages http://www.hauptwerk.cz/irs/select.htm about being able to have several 'channels' in Reaper presumably to feed various organ departments through to get different effects. This sounds better than just a 'blanket' process. How does one go about doing this?

Hauptwerk has been a bit of money pit this week with getting SIRS and having to replace my damaged headphones...and now the middle 'A' on the Great won't work anymore so I will have to get an organ engineer next week to give the 'old girl' a bit a service. :?

Please do help me by buying my organ goodies below, to feed this 'awful and sinful' addiction :mrgreen:
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Re: HW 4 - Reverb using REAPER or BIDULE

Postby 1961TC4ME » Fri Sep 16, 2011 2:39 pm

I just got Reaper 4 up and running last night, it was a job!

I first had it set for audio device "direct sound", and at a buffer of 1024 I had considerable latency, way to much lag in fact, and yes I can see how it would mess up your playing. Setting it to 512 made latency almost non existent with no audio glitches, but still enough to be annoying.

I now have ASIO selected and set at 1024 (I have a 1010LT) and have not needed to go lower on the buffer size, the latency is just about zero as far as I can detect.

Take a look through these.

http://www.voxengo.com/impulses/

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Re: HW 4 - Reverb using REAPER or BIDULE

Postby Grant_Youngman » Fri Sep 16, 2011 3:36 pm

amateurorganist wrote:Hi Grant. Thank-you for that suggestion. I have tried it and it made a little difference. I bought the license for Sir2 this afternoon and fiddling with the settings there made no difference, disappointingly.

Why do IR have latency built into them? I having been using the York Minster & St. Alban's freebies and they both stop me from playing comfortably but the sound is really amazing. The Haverhill IOC extended set sounds out of this world!

1) Can anyone suggest any good IRs (free or paid) without latency worth getting?

2) I was reading on the Sonus Paradisi IR pages http://www.hauptwerk.cz/irs/select.htm about being able to have several 'channels' in Reaper presumably to feed various organ departments through to get different effects. This sounds better than just a 'blanket' process. How does one go about doing this?


I'm running Reaper on a MacPro, with six stereo channels of SIR2 IR (the ones that come with SIR2, several of Jiri's, and a couple others I found here and there), and don't have a latency problem. So there may be something else going on. I don't think the IR's themselves are adding latency. I notice a VERY slight increase in latency over HW direct, but nothing that gets in the way of playing.

My Reaper buffering preference settings are all as follows:
- Auto-detect ... processing threads -- ON
- Thread Priority -- HIGHEST, Behavior 1 ---(this one does also have some effect on latency, if I remember)
- Media buffer size -- 200ms, pre buffer 100%
- Disable media buffering for tracks with open Midi editors -- ON
- Disable media buffering for tracks that are selected -- OFF
- FX Processing/multiprocessing settings -- everything OFF
- Optimize buffering for low latency hardware -- ON
- Use native events for synchronizing -- ON

SIR2 preferences are:
- Plugin Latency -- ZERO
- Resampling quality -- HIGH

I have no idea if these are optimum, but they work for me.

I once played a large electric action Vissar-Roland pipe instrument in a very reverberant church, where the console was located a considerable distance from the pipes. Drove me crazy. You had to not listen to the organ and just play the keys by rote, and hope you got it right. If I'd tried listening to what I was playing it would have caused a seizure :roll:
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Re: HW 4 - Reverb using REAPER or BIDULE

Postby amateurorganist » Fri Sep 16, 2011 5:30 pm

Hi Grant. Altering those settings has worked in terms of the latency. It has gone. :) There are crackles periodically so I guess that has something to do with memory?
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Re: HW 4 - Reverb using REAPER or BIDULE

Postby Grant_Youngman » Fri Sep 16, 2011 6:20 pm

amateurorganist wrote:Hi Grant. Altering those settings has worked in terms of the latency. It has gone. :) There are crackles periodically so I guess that has something to do with memory?


Sounds like progress! That's a good thing :-)

Could be memory, but the crackles may have to do with the settings for Thread Priority and Behavior. I imagine those will be sensitive to the specific machine (speed/cores/etc) you're running HW on. I had to fiddle with them. It would be worth experimenting with those settings. You should be able to find something that eliminates the crackling and doesn't upset latency.
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Re: HW 4 - Reverb using REAPER or BIDULE

Postby amateurorganist » Sat Sep 17, 2011 1:28 am

Grant_Youngman wrote:
amateurorganist wrote:Hi Grant. Altering those settings has worked in terms of the latency. It has gone. :) There are crackles periodically so I guess that has something to do with memory?


Sounds like progress! That's a good thing.

Could be memory, but the crackles may have to do with the settings for Thread Priority and Behavior. I imagine those will be sensitive to the specific machine (speed/cores/etc) you're running HW on. I had to fiddle with them. It would be worth experimenting with those settings. You should be able to find something that eliminates the crackling and doesn't upset latency.
Grant_Youngman wrote:
amateurorganist wrote:Hi Grant. Altering those settings has worked in terms of the latency. It has gone. :) There are crackles periodically so I guess that has something to do with memory?


Sounds like progress! That's a good thing :-)

Could be memory, but the crackles may have to do with the settings for Thread Priority and Behavior. I imagine those will be sensitive to the specific machine (speed/cores/etc) you're running HW on. I had to fiddle with them. It would be worth experimenting with those settings. You should be able to find something that eliminates the crackling and doesn't upset latency.


Thank-you Grant for your all your suggestions! CR is working very well now with no latency or audio issues. I can't tell you happy I am. Having this feature now has given an extra dimension to some of my sample sets. :D
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Re: HW 4 - Reverb using REAPER or BIDULE

Postby conn652t » Mon Sep 19, 2011 3:04 pm

Hi All,
I downloaded the trial version of Reaper and followed the guide in the Hauptwerk manual for setting it up. I found a reverb that worked great. I just have one question, I have 12 channels. Sound is olny coming out of 2 of the 12 speakers. How do you configure Reaper so all 12 speakers work? I am not a computer guru. Was Happy I made it this far but need some help now, or does the trial version not let you do this?
Thanks,
Joel
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Re: HW 4 - Reverb using REAPER or BIDULE

Postby 1961TC4ME » Mon Sep 19, 2011 3:39 pm

Hello Joel,

Check your PM, I ran into the same problem.

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Re: HW 4 - Reverb using REAPER or BIDULE

Postby jharmon » Mon Sep 19, 2011 3:54 pm

Joel, the latest version of Reaper is slightly changed from Martin's instructions. You are only getting sound from one channel because you have not completed the audio output assignments. Across the bottom of your Reaper screen you will see HW 01/02, HW 03/04, etc. Look carefully and you will see "Master" in green. Below Master is RCV in yellow. Beside the RCV are the letters SND and they are greyed out (almost inperceptible). Right click on the SND and a box should appear with Master Send checked. Below Master Send, click on Audio Hardware Output and a list of audio outputs should drop down. Simply assign the channels per your audio output scheme. Once channels are linked, the greyed out SND should change to a visual blue color. Hope this is not too confusing.

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Re: HW 4 - Reverb using REAPER or BIDULE

Postby conn652t » Mon Sep 19, 2011 4:29 pm

Thank You John I will try it.
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Re: HW 4 - Reverb using REAPER or BIDULE

Postby conn652t » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:37 pm

Tried it John and all the speakers did work but I lost my virtual chambers. Reaper put everysound thru every speaker. No seperation of sounds at all and the bass was very weak.
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Re: HW 4 - Reverb using REAPER or BIDULE

Postby jharmon » Mon Sep 19, 2011 5:58 pm

Sorry Joel, I'll have to pass on where your new problem might be. I'm using Reaper | Reverberate from LiquidSonics | Jiri Zurek's IRs. Outside of this configuration I would be blindly guessing as to the source of the problem.

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