Search:
Submit Search


Speeding up console configuartion

Hauptwerk software technical support only. Please make sure you have read the manual, tutorials and FAQ pages before requesting support.

Speeding up console configuartion

Postby kaspencer » Mon Dec 04, 2017 7:36 am

Good morning all.

Question: "What are the speediest approaches to setting MIDI OUT parameters when the settings cannot be matched to the MIDI IN parameters for a set of controls"?

Please forgive me if my question has previously been answered - if it has, I couldn't find it!
I am wondering about whether there are any methods of speeding up the configuring MIDI OUT parameters for a large console for a series of sample sets, when the console is not one of the standard consoles listed when Hauptwerk is first installed - for example, when it is custom made.

The most significant area is that of MIDI OUT where illuminated, or electro-magnetically operated controls are present and they cannot be matched to the MIDI settings. It seems to me that there could be speedier method of configuring than repeating the process of selecting all the parameters for 30 or 40 illuminated pistons, or for 80 or more stop controls. For example, can we make Hauptwerk remember the last used setting, so that we might only need to change say a Note Number? Or is it possible to use a script (like a macro) containing the parameters?

I shall look forward to possible replies with interest!

Best wishes (Even Christmas Greetings to the team, and to Forum Users, if it isn't too early)

Kenneth Spencer
Kenneth Spencer
Music Site: http://www.my-music.mine.nu
Project Page: http://www.my-music.mine.nu/project.htm
Books on Hauptwerk and Computing; Novation Launchpad overlays: http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/kaspencer
YouTube Videos: http://www.youtube.com/kaspenceruk
User avatar
kaspencer
Member
 
Posts: 672
Joined: Wed Jun 11, 2008 5:42 pm
Location: UK, England, Wiltshire.

Re: Speeding up console configuartion

Postby mdyde » Mon Dec 04, 2017 8:05 am

Hello Kenneth,

To my knowledge, all commercially-made digital/electronic organs use matching MIDI input and output parameters for their stops (intentionally so that they can be recorded and replayed via MIDI sequencers). That also has the major benefit that auto-detection can configure them automatically, both for input and output, which wouldn't otherwise be possible.

The Hauptwerk user guide strongly recommends that the same approach be adopted if building your own do-it-yourself console, for the same reasons. As far as I know, all commercially made consoles designed for Hauptwerk do adopt that recommendation.

If building a console yourself, then why not just follow that recommendation? It wouldn't normally add any cost or complexity to do so. Have you built a console yourself that doesn't do that? If not, could you not reconfigure the MIDI encoder/decoders appropriately?

(I appreciate that it would, for example, technically be possible to implement translation tables to remember mappings for each given MIDI switch so as to re-use the mappings when auto-detecting that switch again, and/or to add macro/scripting ability, etc., but those things would be significant amounts of work to implement and add considerable technical complexity both internally and for the user. Surely it's better instead just configure the MIDI encoders/decoders appropriately in the first place?)
Best regards,
Martin.

[Please use email or the Contact page if you need to contact us privately, rather than private forum messages.]

Image
User avatar
mdyde
Moderator
 
Posts: 10644
Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2003 2:19 pm
Location: UK

Re: Speeding up console configuration

Postby kaspencer » Mon Dec 04, 2017 1:46 pm

Thanks, Martin, for the speedy reply.

Indeed my question relates to building/configuring a console.

In some cases (e.g. the control of thumb pistons and draw stops in particular), the MIDI parameters of the MIDI IN functions may not match those for MIDI OUT. This may be the case when the controller boards are separate and hence configuring the controls using the matching option will not always work.
It is a pity when they do not match, but it doesn't seem that I can do much about it. The setting up can be done of course, but it is much less speedy and convenient than it could be.
It could be made much faster if the dialogue for setting MIDI OUT parameters could be made so that it remembers (if selected) the parameters of the previous control configured - of course I appreciate that it may be a rare request, but if one never asks, one is never likely to receive!

Many thanks for your help, and of course, Christmas good wishes, if it isn't too early!

Best wishes

Kenneth Spencer
Kenneth Spencer
Music Site: http://www.my-music.mine.nu
Project Page: http://www.my-music.mine.nu/project.htm
Books on Hauptwerk and Computing; Novation Launchpad overlays: http://www.lulu.com/spotlight/kaspencer
YouTube Videos: http://www.youtube.com/kaspenceruk
User avatar
kaspencer
Member
 
Posts: 672
Joined: Wed Jun 11, 2008 5:42 pm
Location: UK, England, Wiltshire.

Re: Speeding up console configuartion

Postby mdyde » Mon Dec 04, 2017 2:17 pm

Thanks, Kenneth.

Early Christmas wishes to you as well!

kaspencer wrote:In some cases (e.g. the control of thumb pistons and draw stops in particular), the MIDI parameters of the MIDI IN functions may not match those for MIDI OUT. This may be the case when the controller boards are separate


I'm not sure that I see why would that necessarily be the case? If you're wiring and configuring the encoder and decoder boards yourself, then why not simply make the MIDI implementations them match (so that any given solenoid-actuated/illuminated MIDI draw-knob/tab/switch/piston uses the same MIDI note number for output as input, for example)?

If you sometimes wanted to use a MIDI piston to toggle a MIDI draw-knob, for example, then there you would be no need for the piston's MIDI implementation to be related to that of the draw-knob -- you would normally just auto-detect the draw-knob to the virtual switch's 'input 1', and the piston to 'input 2', for example. It would only be the MIDI draw-knob that would would need to use the same MIDI implementation for both input and output.

Is it just that you've wired or configured the MIDI encoder/decoder hardware a different way for some reason and are (understandably) rather reluctant to change it now? Addressing it at the encoder/decoder level really would be by far the best long-term solution.
Best regards,
Martin.

[Please use email or the Contact page if you need to contact us privately, rather than private forum messages.]

Image
User avatar
mdyde
Moderator
 
Posts: 10644
Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2003 2:19 pm
Location: UK

Re: Speeding up console configuartion

Postby mnailor » Mon Dec 04, 2017 4:05 pm

I thought about buying CMK3 lighted piston keyboards for my new console last year. I decided against lighted pistons because, reading the tutorial (link below), you have to manually set the output to a specific NPRN number per piston for each light to work. An email to Classic MIDI Works confirmed that Hauptwerk can't just send out the same input MIDI code from autolearn to work the lighted pistons. I'm not willing to take that much time for each organ.

http://us.midiworks.ca/index.php/suppor ... ed-pistons

This seems to be an example where the console gear doesn't make the input = output assumption work. I have no clue why it was built this way...
mnailor
Member
 
Posts: 382
Joined: Sat Nov 30, 2013 6:57 pm
Location: Atlanta, GA

Re: Speeding up console configuartion

Postby jkinkennon » Mon Dec 04, 2017 4:30 pm

One possibility for MIDI In and MIDI Out would be to purchase Bome MIDI Translator Pro for about $70 and configure one direction of MIDI to match the other. It seems that one translation would serve for most if not all sample sets.

A second possibility would be to look for MIDI encoders/decoders with built in translation tables. I believe that many of the MIDI Boutique products have that ability.

It might also be possible to get a custom table built into an encoder -- ask the developer what could be done. I suspect that hardware translators such as from MIDI Solutions might do the same.
jkinkennon
Member
 
Posts: 927
Joined: Thu May 07, 2009 10:43 am
Location: Vancouver, WA

Re: Speeding up console configuartion

Postby mdyde » Tue Dec 05, 2017 7:37 am

Hello Kenneth/nmailor,

I've logged an enhancement request for the possibility of making Hauptwerk automatically remember the MIDI output settings that the user last configured for each given combination of auto-detected MIDI input switch settings, so that you could optionally choose to tell it to re-use the last known MIDI output settings for any given MIDI switch when auto-detecting it.

(However, I can't make any promises about specifically when, or whether, we might be able to undertake that, I'm afraid. We only have development resources to undertake a tiny fraction of the enhancement requests, so we have to prioritise things very carefully according to how many people they'll benefit, etc.)

Either way (and in the meantime), if at all feasible, I think the best full solution would still be to configure the MIDI encoders/decoders appropriately in the first-place, so that no work-arounds would be needed.

mnailor wrote:I thought about buying CMK3 lighted piston keyboards for my new console last year. I decided against lighted pistons because, reading the tutorial (link below), you have to manually set the output to a specific NPRN number per piston for each light to work. An email to Classic MIDI Works confirmed that Hauptwerk can't just send out the same input MIDI code from autolearn to work the lighted pistons. I'm not willing to take that much time for each organ.

http://us.midiworks.ca/index.php/suppor ... ed-pistons

This seems to be an example where the console gear doesn't make the input = output assumption work. I have no clue why it was built this way...


Thanks for the information. I wasn't aware of that. I too am not sure why they would have implemented it that way.
Best regards,
Martin.

[Please use email or the Contact page if you need to contact us privately, rather than private forum messages.]

Image
User avatar
mdyde
Moderator
 
Posts: 10644
Joined: Fri Mar 14, 2003 2:19 pm
Location: UK


Return to Technical support

Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 1 guest