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Hauptwerk hangs at Audio/MIDI start

PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2020 6:37 am
by dhm
When I get to "Please wait while Audio and MIDI starts", HW always hangs at 85% for c.6-7 seconds (irrespective of which PC, sample-set or Windows version is in use). Is this the expected procedure?

Re: Hauptwerk hangs at Audio/MIDI start

PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2020 6:43 am
by NickNelson
Yes, I believe this is intentional (and adjustable).

You can reduce the 'extra' wait time to 0 in General Settings -> General Preferences -> Advanced Preferences

Ncik

Re: Hauptwerk hangs at Audio/MIDI start

PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2020 7:32 am
by mdyde
Hello Douglas,

[Topic moved here.]

To confirm Nick's reply (thanks, Nick), yes -- please see the new 'Extra time to allow when starting audio on Windows if not running at real-time priority' advanced general preference for that (it's covered in detail on page 17 in the v5.0.0 release notice, and in the section on the general preferences in the main user guide).

Re: Hauptwerk hangs at Audio/MIDI start

PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2020 7:55 am
by dhm
Thanks, Martin.
It wasn't a problem - I just wondered why it was happening. Now I know the answer.
I found the relevant references on pp 139 and 252 of the User Guide (nothing on p17 :D ).

Re: Hauptwerk hangs at Audio/MIDI start

PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2020 7:58 am
by mdyde
Thanks, Douglas.

Page 17 in the release notice (as opposed to the user guide).

Re: Hauptwerk hangs at Audio/MIDI start

PostPosted: Fri Jan 17, 2020 8:06 am
by dhm
mdyde wrote:Thanks, Douglas.

Page 17 in the release notice (as opposed to the user guide).

Oops - Sorry!

Re: Hauptwerk hangs at Audio/MIDI start

PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 6:08 am
by Mindenblues
mdyde wrote:To confirm Nick's reply (thanks, Nick), yes -- please see the new 'Extra time to allow when starting audio on Windows if not running at real-time priority' advanced general preference for that (it's covered in detail on page 17 in the v5.0.0 release notice, and in the section on the general preferences in the main user guide).


A question to that:
In the case that the check mark is set on 'Try to run Hauptwerk at real-time priority on Windows' and we have some seconds entered at 'Extra time to allow... if not running at real-time priority..' and Hauptwerk indeed waits that time:
Does that mean that Hauptwerk is NOT running at real-time priority, because we see that extra wait time happens?
So that this is an indicator that even if we liked to have Hauptwerk running at real-time priority, that did not happen?

Because that happens in my case, I had the check mark set, but there is also wait time.
I use Win7SP1, only Hauptwerk needs to run and I thought that it does with administrator privileges - but it seems not to be the case then.
So the question is what can I do in Win7SP1 that Hauptwerk can run with administrator privileges (what I hoped that it is the case).
Is there a check that I can see with which priviledges Hauptwerk is running?

Best regards,
Olaf

Re: Hauptwerk hangs at Audio/MIDI start

PostPosted: Tue Jan 21, 2020 6:38 am
by mdyde
Hello Olaf,

Mindenblues wrote:n the case that the check mark is set on 'Try to run Hauptwerk at real-time priority on Windows' and we have some seconds entered at 'Extra time to allow... if not running at real-time priority..' and Hauptwerk indeed waits that time:
Does that mean that Hauptwerk is NOT running at real-time priority, because we see that extra wait time happens?


Correct. It means that Windows didn't allow Hauptwerk to set its process priority to real-time.

Mindenblues wrote:o that this is an indicator that even if we liked to have Hauptwerk running at real-time priority, that did not happen?


Correct. Windows will normally only allow an application to set its process priority to real-time if it's launched 'as administrator'.

Mindenblues wrote:Because that happens in my case, I had the check mark set, but there is also wait time.
I use Win7SP1, only Hauptwerk needs to run and I thought that it does with administrator privileges - but it seems not to be the case then.
So the question is what can I do in Win7SP1 that Hauptwerk can run with administrator privileges (what I hoped that it is the case).
Is there a check that I can see with which priviledges Hauptwerk is running?


Even if your Windows account has administrator privileges, Windows won't normally actually launch a process with administrator privileges unless you right-click on the application/short-cut (e.g. Hauptwerk) and select 'Run as administrator'.

If you launch it that way, you should then find that Hauptwerk will be able to set its priority to real-time (and so the delay won't be needed and won't occur).

You can check processes' priorities via the 'Base priority' column on the Details tab in Windows Task Manager (Ctrl+Alt+Del).

Re: Hauptwerk hangs at Audio/MIDI start

PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 2:59 am
by Mindenblues
Many thanks, Martin, that advice helped!

I have put HW5 in the Autostart folder in order that it starts automatically when the PC has booted. Here it was not sufficient to set "Run as administrator" within the shortcut properties for HW5. I needed to also to put another setting on my Win7SP1 system to allow for not asking regarding allowing for adminstrator priviledges so that HW5 can start without any other interactions automatically, but with administrator priviledge. And this way this Audio/Midi start delay does not happen anymore.

Martin, I like to say thank you for your high quality HW5 product and also your excellent support you do!

/BR
Olaf

Re: Hauptwerk hangs at Audio/MIDI start

PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 5:35 am
by mdyde
Thanks very much, Olaf.

You're very welcome, very kind of you to say so, and glad to hear you have it configured how you'd like it now.

Re: Hauptwerk hangs at Audio/MIDI start

PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 6:19 am
by NickNelson
Mindenblues wrote:Here it was not sufficient to set "Run as administrator" within the shortcut properties for HW5. I needed to also to put another setting on my Win7SP1 system to allow for not asking regarding allowing for adminstrator priviledges so that HW5 can start without any other interactions automatically, but with administrator priviledge.


Does anyone happen to know how (if) this can be done in Windows 10? As a relative beginner with W10, I haven't managed it yet.

Nick

Re: Hauptwerk hangs at Audio/MIDI start

PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 8:49 am
by micdev
Does anyone happen to know how (if) this can be done in Windows 10? As a relative beginner with W10, I haven't managed it yet.


See the following page to learn how to set a program so it will always run with administrator privileges.

https://www.windowscentral.com/how-set-apps-always-run-administrator-windows-10

In this example, we explain how to run as admin CMD, but you can search for Hauptwerk (step 2) and follow the instructions. Then once done Hauptwerk will always run as administrator.

Then add Hauptwerk to the Win10 startup folder.

- Press WIN+R and type shell:startup
- Copy or drag and drop Hauptwerk shortcut to the startup folder.

Regards

Re: Hauptwerk hangs at Audio/MIDI start

PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 9:22 am
by Mindenblues
micdev wrote:[See the following page to learn how to set a program so it will always run with administrator privileges.

https://www.windowscentral.com/how-set-apps-always-run-administrator-windows-10

In this example, we explain how to run as admin CMD, but you can search for Hauptwerk (step 2) and follow the instructions. Then once done Hauptwerk will always run as administrator.

Then add Hauptwerk to the Win10 startup folder.

- Press WIN+R and type shell:startup
- Copy or drag and drop Hauptwerk shortcut to the startup folder.


For Win7SP1, there we have the same advanced setting on the Hauptwerk shortcut to turn on to always run as administrator. But at least for Win7SP1 that is not enough - Hauptwerk will not startup automatically. Because there is a dialog asking every time whether really Hauptwerk shall be started with administrator priviledge. Some other settings is necessary to avoid that additional dialog.
Is that really for Win10 not necessary, that additional dialog does not pop up in the case of Autostart without any other things to do?

Re: Hauptwerk hangs at Audio/MIDI start

PostPosted: Wed Jan 22, 2020 10:36 am
by micdev
You can create a batch file with the following command:

start "Hauptwerk" /normal c:\program files\Hauptwerk Virtual Pipe organ\Hauptwerk.exe

To learn about this command, in a CMD screen type Start /?

Regards

Re: Hauptwerk hangs at Audio/MIDI start

PostPosted: Thu Jan 23, 2020 3:52 am
by Mindenblues
micdev wrote:You can create a batch file with the following command:

start "Hauptwerk" /normal c:\program files\Hauptwerk Virtual Pipe organ\Hauptwerk.exe

To learn about this command, in a CMD screen type Start /?


The question was how we can manage to get Hauptwerk running with administrator priviledges without additional dialog while starting. The question was not to automatically start the application in normal priority class (by the way, why not use then /realtime instead /normal, if Hauptwerk is the only application what is of interest for our Hauptwerk organ PC)?

And the point is, at least for Win7SP1, regardless whether a batch job or a shortcut is used in the Autostart folder with applied administrator priviledges in the advanced settings, how to get managed that no dialog appears at starting, what asks whether we really like to start with administrator priviledges.

But as I said, for me I solved the problem to overcome that that additional dialog, but your advice (@micdev) seems misleading (for others).