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SP: Freiberg or Velesovo?

Existing and forthcoming Hauptwerk instruments, recommendations, ...

SP: Freiberg or Velesovo?

Postby marcus.reeves » Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:08 pm

I've been very interested in the recent release of Freiberg v.2 and have been giving v.1 a thorough going over on my Hauptwerk setup. Today, for comparison I downloaded the Velesovo demo and tried that too. Now I have a dilemma, which should I go for?

There's a lot I like about the Freiberg set: there are some lovely stops, including the Fachott, and Vox Humana, and the set is dry, so it sounds good in the reverberant acoustic of my Chapel. However, the lack of 2' flutes is slightly frustrating, and the sound (currently unvoiced) is quite brash. Velesovo, straight "out of the box", sounds better to my ears: stronger mid range and less shrill.

However, I was wondering what other users' opinions on these sets might be? I'm certainly going to buy one or the other: it's just a question of which!

Many thanks for your thoughts.
Best wishes,
Marcus
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Re: SP: Freiberg or Velesovo?

Postby ajt » Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:34 pm

If I could buy the Velosovo demo set as it is, I would. I love it. It can play almost any repertoire.
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Re: SP: Freiberg or Velesovo?

Postby polikimre » Wed Mar 09, 2011 4:59 pm

I'm facing the exact same dilemma, I'm curious about others's opinions.
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Re: SP: Freiberg or Velesovo?

Postby rogbi200 » Wed Mar 09, 2011 6:05 pm

Gosh, I've been thinking identically over the last few days as well- The advantage of Velesovo for me is that it would exactly fit the stop tabs on my console, and I like the sound, though having heard Freiberg I've been having similar dilemma-like thoughts. Velesovo doesn't have a dry option, though I'm not too worried about that- I'm only looking at home use. I tried Freiberg demo wet, then dry 'out of the box' with the simple Convolution Reverb setup (using York Minster IRs) and I much preferred the original wet set, though admittedly would have to spend much more setup time tweaking the IRs and the voicing to get the best 'dry' sound.

I have been doing quite a bit of listening recently to recordings of some of Bernard Aubertin's instruments, particularly St Louis en l'ile http://www.thediapason.com/A-New-Aubertin-Organ-in-the-German-Baroque-Style-article6766. That instrument claims to owe many influences to Zacharias Hildebrandt as does Velesovo, and if I can't (yet) have a HW sampled Aubertin, then maybe, just maybe, Velesovo is the next best thing!
I've certainly enjoyed the demo set- the richness of tone which is a wonderful antedote to some rather shriller neo-baroque instruments- which has even inspired me to set up some surround speakers; and Velesovo is quite a bit cheaper than Freiberg (wet/surround).

However it has I think to be down to personal taste and needs when it comes down to a final decision.
Last edited by rogbi200 on Thu Mar 10, 2011 3:53 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: SP: Freiberg or Velesovo?

Postby sonar11 » Wed Mar 09, 2011 6:31 pm

I can't speak for the Freiberg, but I own the full Velesovo set and really like it. As rogbi200 mentioned, it also fits very well with my digital organ and I never have to use a touch screen when playing this set. Of course your console may be different, but maybe one of those samples really matches your console / stops?

Velesovo can also be run "dry" by simply truncating the release notes... this is "simulated dry" but in my experience when I was testing that, it worked quite well. I just happen to prefer the original acoustics and haven't been able to beat that with software reverb. I'm only using 2 channel right now but hope to get the surround sound working in the very near future.

I would recommend Velesovo as a "first buy" or "daily sample" to anybody who cares to listen :)
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Re: SP: Freiberg or Velesovo?

Postby ajt » Wed Mar 09, 2011 6:49 pm

I love the sweetness of tone of the Velosovo; it contrasts beautifully with the Haverhill without having the shrillness that the Pipeloops Silbermann does, for example.

I've played French stuff on it, Mendelssohn, Karg Elert, even some Howells (though it was less successful) plus, of course, all the Baroque repertoire. And this just on the demo. I'm fairly certain this will be my next sampleset for both home and church.
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Re: SP: Freiberg or Velesovo?

Postby rogbi200 » Wed Mar 09, 2011 7:06 pm

Also worth bearing in mind that Al Morse has made some 3 manual config files of Velesovo which might be useful:

http://morse.home.comcast.net/~morse/content_hacking.html
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Re: SP: Freiberg or Velesovo?

Postby ljhutchens » Thu Mar 10, 2011 2:20 am

I own both sample sets and I love them both. Juri has done an amazing job with version 2 of the Freiberg organ. To me it is the premier baroque organ sound. I like the Velesovo also because you can play Bach to Brahms and it really makes into a very nice semi-romantic instrument. For Bach I like the Freiberg but the Velesovo is more versatile for other periods of music. and does an adequate job for the baroque literature. My suggestion is to save up and get both. The 3 manual free Velesovo upgrade is interesting. I made a celeste in the original sample set by detuning one of the quieter stops. It works very nicely. You need to able to voice the mixtures and other upperwork to work with the speakers you are using. There is not a hint of shrillness on the Freiberg but I am using Klipsch La Scallas and Cornwall speakers and the tweeters are very accurate. I am sure that someone can help you voice the upperwork. A simple reduction in volume and cutting down the highs can be accomplished very easily.
Last edited by ljhutchens on Thu Mar 10, 2011 11:14 am, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: SP: Freiberg or Velesovo?

Postby Fazioli » Thu Mar 10, 2011 4:30 am

Having heard both sample-sets in real church accoustics during concerts i can tell You that Freiberg sounded much more realistic to me..
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Re: SP: Freiberg or Velesovo?

Postby Andruss » Thu Mar 10, 2011 5:14 am

Velesovo:

+ bigger
+ cheaper
+ more universal
- no dry version

Freiberg:
+ Silberman :)
+ there is dry version
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http://www.magnus-organy.eu
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Re: SP: Freiberg or Velesovo?

Postby marcus.reeves » Thu Mar 10, 2011 7:15 am

Thanks for all the responses so far. I'm glad that I'm not alone in facing this dilemma!

sonar11 wrote:I can't speak for the Freiberg, but I own the full Velesovo set and really like it. As rogbi200 mentioned, it also fits very well with my digital organ and I never have to use a touch screen when playing this set. Of course your console may be different, but maybe one of those samples really matches your console / stops?

Velesovo can also be run "dry" by simply truncating the release notes... this is "simulated dry" but in my experience when I was testing that, it worked quite well.


I'm fortunate that both Velesovo and Freiberg fit my console well. I've also tried Velesovo with truncated releases and it works well in the Chapel's acoustic.

ljhutchens wrote:I own both sample sets and I love them both. Juri has done an amazing job with version 2 of the Freiberg organ. To me it is the premier baroque organ sound. I like the Velesovo also because you can play Bach to Brahms and it really makes into a very nice semi-romantic instrument. For Bach I like the Freiberg but the Velesovo is more versatile for other periods of music. and does an adequate job for the baroque literature. My suggestion is to save up and get both.


I agree that the Freiberg set is great for baroque music, especially the sweeter, solo stops. The Cornet is fantastic! It's just the pleno that doesn't sound so (in my installations acoustic) great to me: the mixtures are quite harsh (as Silbermann mixtures tend to be), and the 16' foundation is strong. Sadly, I don't have the time or the expertise to really get to grips with detailed voicing. Saving for both may be the way forward.

I note that Velesovo has not got dedicated cornet. How do people find the separated cornet option on Velesovo?

I already have the Pipeloops Silbermann, and was interested in a smallish Baroque instrument with some reeds. I may stick with that Silbermann for the time being and go for Velesovo. The more I play it, the more I like it... only then I play Freiberg and like that too...
Best wishes,
Marcus
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Re: SP: Freiberg or Velesovo?

Postby Morse » Thu Mar 10, 2011 9:18 am

ljhutchens wrote: The 3 manual free Velesovo upgrade is interesting but there are compromises with the voicing which detract from the original samples.

I don't understand this comment. The free 3 manual versions use the original samples. If you only pull the original stops, you have the original Velesovo organ. It is the new additional stops which have altered voicing. The altered voicing of these stops is significant in some cases and is a matter of personal preference.

In any event, since all stops start by loading the original samples, the voicing of any stop can be easily customized to your liking using Hauptwerk's voicing controls.
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Re: SP: Freiberg or Velesovo?

Postby rogbi200 » Tue Mar 15, 2011 2:30 pm

Finally decided to order Velesovo last night. I gave myself a further week to listen, think and research, and found myself coming back to this sample set time after time, not to mention playing the demo a lot. I look forward to putting it though its paces!
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Re: SP: Freiberg or Velesovo?

Postby dhm » Tue Mar 15, 2011 3:02 pm

rogbi200 wrote:Finally decided to order Velesovo last night. I gave myself a further week to listen, think and research, and found myself coming back to this sample set time after time, not to mention playing the demo a lot. I look forward to putting it though its paces!

You won't regret it. Enjoy!
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http://www.midi-organs.eu / http://www.gundulf.org.uk
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Re: SP: Freiberg or Velesovo?

Postby polikimre » Tue Mar 15, 2011 5:34 pm

I'm also tending towards Velesovo, however one of my concerns is that almost all recordings and the demo organ sound as if the organ was behind a heavy curtain, it is not as "present" as Freiberg. Can anyone comment on this? I know I can adjust this with voicing to some extent, I just want to make sure it is normal.
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