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Upgrading to better technology

A discussion forum for anything even marginally Hauptwerk-related.
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engrssc

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Re: Which option to choose ?

PostSat Jun 12, 2021 4:43 pm

micdev wrote:" You will need to download all of your ENCRYPTED sample sets to the latest version(s) as the previous (HW Version 4.2) won't work with the latest V6."


Plus once you "convert" to the iLok system, your old (HASP) dongle will no longer work.
Also, is 4 audio outputs all that you need?

Rgds,
Ed
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Antoni Scott

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Re: Which option to choose ?

PostSat Jun 12, 2021 8:49 pm

Hello Francois:
I live in a condominium with neighbors close by. Out of consideration to them, I use my headphones and a subwoofer. When I first got my Hauptwerk back in 2008 I got the eight channel PreSonus FP10. with many speakers and amps. I also have a PreSonus headphone preamp that I plugged into the PreSonus. Today I only need four "out" .
Antoni
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Antoni Scott

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Re: Which option to choose ?

PostSat Jun 12, 2021 9:00 pm

This may seem like a dumb question, but I have to ask it. I have four hard drives in my MacPro. Two of them have Hauptwerk 4.0.0 on them and the other two have 4.2 on them.
Where does the Mac OSX 10.10.3 system reside ? On each hard drive ? or one hard drive ? or somewhere else ? I see a message that one hard drive has the Start Up disc on it which suggests that one hard drive starts the operating system, but if I am using one of the other three that doesn't have the OSX system on it, how does that work ?

Also, more important. I was asked to ask if any other Hauptwerk user out these uses the PreSonus FP10 Audio Interface with Hauptwerk V or VI and OSX 10.14 ? That way for sure I'll know.

Antoni
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larason2

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Re: Which option to choose ?

PostSat Jun 12, 2021 9:29 pm

OSX, and every other OS that I know of, require a boot disk. You can have multiple copies of an operating system, one on each hard drive, however, the BIOS, which is the program that starts the operating system when the computer first boots, has one drive set as the startup drive, and that’s the one it starts up. You can use the other hard drives within the OS, but that doesn’t mean the computer booted from them.

I’m pretty sure if the FP10 worked on 10.13 that it will work on 10.14. Most of the improvements between those two versions were mainly superficial. It was after the update to 10.15 that a lot of people started having compatibility problems. Either way, you can check on the presonus website to see if they have drivers that support 10.14 before taking the plunge.
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mdyde

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Re: Which option to choose ?

PostSun Jun 13, 2021 5:01 am

Hello Antoni,

Antoni Scott wrote:May need to replace PreSonus Audio Interface. Will contact PreSonus directly.

MOTU M4 $239
https://www.fullcompass.com/prod/582673 ... moQAvD_BwE


(If your PreSonus FP10 turns out not to be usable on macOS 10.14) I'd expect a MOTU M4 to be fine. MOTU state that it works on macOS 10.11 or later without a driver, or macOS 10.13 if its optional driver is used:

https://motu.com/en-us/products/m-series/m4/specs/

Antoni Scott wrote:Install two new Internal Hard drives.

Seagate BarraCuda 2TB Internal Hard Drive HDD – 3.5 Inch SATA 6Gb/s 7200 RPM 256MB Cache 3.5-Inch –
Price: $55.49

Seagate BarraCuda 2TB Internal Hard Drive HDD – 3.5 Inch SATA 6Gb/s 7200 RPM 256MB Cache 3.5-Inch –
Price: $55.49


Whilst they should work perfectly well, if you were instead to get two 2 GB SATA SSDs (instead of hard-drives) then organs would load much faster, and the Mac would boot faster. Especially if you switch between different organs frequently you may well appreciate the extra speed benefit of getting SSDs (instead of hard-drives). Most Hauptwerk users opt for SSDs these days.

Antoni Scott wrote:iLok 3 dongle. USB 2.0 version
PACE iLok3 USB Key Software Authorization Device
(99007120900)
Brand: PACEPrice: $44.95

Upgrade Advanced v4 to Advanced v6 Perpetual
Hauptwerk VI Advanced EditionUpgrade
$299.00

AdvanceHauptwerk VI License Migration $30.00
Purchase this product after upgrading to Hauptwerk VI or higher to migrate all of your licensed instruments you have from previous Hauptwerk 4 versions (or earlier) to the Pace iLok platform.


Yes.

Antoni Scott wrote:At the present time ... OSX Yosemite Version 10.10.3 is the operating system .


As larason2 mentioned, if you're currently using your PreSonus FP10 on macOS 10.13 successfully, then it will almost certainly work equally well on 10.14 too (even if PreSonus say that they don't officially support it). However, as discussed in one of your other threads on upgrading, either of macOS 10.13 or 10.14 is equally good for Hauptwerk v6 (it makes no difference which, from Hauptwerk v6's point of view), so if your FP10 is definitely working on 10.13 then you might want to install 10.13 on your new drives (instead of 10.14) simply because then your FP10 would presumably still be usable (just in case the FP10 works with 10.13 but not 10.14, even though that situation is unlikely). I.e. going with 10.13 might be the safer bet, in terms of compatibility with your FP10.

On the other hand, since 10.14 is a year newer than 10.13, 10.14 will probably continue to be supported by Apple for security updates, and maybe hardware/software/driver makers, for a bit longer than 10.13 would. Hence 10.14 may be the better mid-term bet (and your FP10 will almost certainly work on it if it works on 10.13, as larason2 mentioned). You could try your FP10 on it, and if it turns out not to work after all, then you could buy a new audio/MIDI interface at that point in time.

Antoni Scott wrote:After I install OSX 10.14 followed by th install of Version VI on a new hard drive with nothing else on it, will I still be able to switch over to my current hard drives and load them. At the present time I have organs loaded onto my hard drives with Hauptwerk 4.0.0. and 4.2 on another hard drive that I can switch back and forth in a minute.


As Ed mentioned, no -- you won't be able to continue to use v4 once you've upgrade to v6 (v5+). (The licensing sections in the user guide and release notice cover that.) However, there would be no need to keep the v4 installations anyway.
Best regards, Martin.
Hauptwerk software designer/developer, Milan Digital Audio.
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engrssc

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Re: Which option to choose ?

PostSun Jun 13, 2021 7:17 am

mdyde wrote:Whilst they should work perfectly well, if you were instead to get two 2 GB SATA SSDs (instead of hard-drives) then organs would load much faster, and the Mac would boot faster. Especially if you switch between different organs frequently you may well appreciate the extra speed benefit of getting SSDs (instead of hard-drives). Most Hauptwerk users opt for SSDs these days.


I think Martin meant to say 2 TB SATA SSDs.

Rgds,
Ed
Last edited by engrssc on Sun Jun 13, 2021 7:25 am, edited 2 times in total.
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engrssc

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Re: Which option to choose ?

PostSun Jun 13, 2021 7:21 am

Considering the use of larger storage these days, I'm looking for someone to consider using a NAS (Network Attached Server) :roll:

Rgds,
Ed
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mdyde

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Re: Which option to choose ?

PostSun Jun 13, 2021 8:09 am

engrssc wrote:I think Martin meant to say 2 TB SATA SSDs.


Thanks, Ed. I did indeed mean to write 2 TB.
Best regards, Martin.
Hauptwerk software designer/developer, Milan Digital Audio.
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Antoni Scott

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Re: Upgrading to better technology

PostSun Jun 13, 2021 8:19 am

As larason2 mentioned, if you're currently using PreSonus FP10 on macOS 10.13 successfully, then it will almost certainly work equally well on 10.14 too (even if PreSonus say that they don't officially support it). However, as discussed in one of your other threads on upgrading, either of macOS 10.13 or 10.14 is equally good for Hauptwerk v6 (it makes no difference which, from Hauptwerk v6's point of view), so if your FP10 is definitely working on 10.13 then you might want to install 10.13 on your new drives (instead of 10.14) simply because then your FP10 would presumably still be usable (just in case the FP10 works with 10.13 but not 10.14, even though that situation is unlikely). I.e. going with 10.13 might be the safer bet, in terms of compatibility with your FP10.

On the other hand, since 10.14 is a year newer than 10.13, 10.14 will probably continue to be supported by Apple for security updates, and maybe hardware/software/driver makers, for a bit longer than 10.13 would. Hence 10.14 may be the better mid-term bet (and your FP10 will almost certainly work on it if it works on 10.13, as larason2 mentioned). You could try your FP10 on it, and if it turns out not to work after all, then you could buy a new audio/MIDI interface at that point in time.


Possible misunderstanding on my part: My current operating system is 10.3, not 10.13. I'll call preSonus tomorrow and try and get a definitive answer to my question : "Will the PreSonus FP10 work with OS 10.13or 10.14 ? " . Their website says "10.3 or HIGHER". How much higher is my question.

Francois said to use 10.13, rather than 10.14, but I can't remember why he said that. There has to be a reason.
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mdyde

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Re: Upgrading to better technology

PostSun Jun 13, 2021 8:42 am

Thanks, Antoni.

Antoni Scott wrote:Possible misunderstanding on my part: My current operating system is 10.3, not 10.13. I'll call preSonus tomorrow and try and get a definitive answer to my question : "Will the PreSonus FP10 work with OS 10.13or 10.14 ? " . Their website says "10.3 or HIGHER". How much higher is my question.


Yes -- in that case you should definitely check with them.
Best regards, Martin.
Hauptwerk software designer/developer, Milan Digital Audio.
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Antoni Scott

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Operating system on multi-drive computers

PostSun Jun 13, 2021 8:45 am

Larason 2 wrote:
OSX, and every other OS that I know of, require a boot disk. You can have multiple copies of an operating system, one on each hard drive, however, the BIOS, which is the program that starts the operating system when the computer first boots, has one drive set as the startup drive, and that’s the one it starts up. You can use the other hard drives within the OS, but that doesn’t mean the computer booted from them.


I think I have the operating system (Yosemite 10.3) installed on each of my four drives. According to Larason2, the startup drive (BIOS) is on one of the four drives. Can I get the start up (BIOS) installed on all four drives ?
Reason: If the drive that contains the BIOS crashes, I won't be able to start up my computer ? Right ?

I have another entire computer as a back-up (my original MacPro 8 core). I was prompted to go this route and get an entire computer as a backup after my computer stopped working back in 2014. I was without my Hauptwerk for months before a third party vendor (recommended by a Hauptwerk enthusiast on this Forum) told me how to diagnose the problem. All it was, was a single RAM module that went bad. Apple refused to look at my computer as it was considered Vintage.

So now, If everything fails I have a back up computer. But if my start up disc with the BIOS on it fails, I have nothing. I need to find out if every drive can have this BIOS on it.

Am I paranoid ? Darn right I am.

Antoni
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mdyde

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Re: Which option to choose ?

PostSun Jun 13, 2021 9:10 am

Hello Antoni,

[I've merged your new topic into this one, to avoid potential duplication.]

When you get the person to install macOS 10.14 (or 10.13) on your new drive, the drive will itself be bootable, so you don't need to worry. Even if you have multiple operating systems installed, each on a separate drive, you can choose which operating system the Mac boots from by holding down its 'option' key when you turn it on.

There's no need to keep your 2008 Mac Pro since it won't be able to run Hauptwerk v6 (v5+), and once you've migrated your licences to v6 you won't be able to run v4 any more anyway (as discussed previously).

Once the new drive is set up, you could simply get the person who does the macOS/Hauptwerk v6 installation for you to clone one of your two drives to the other, so that you have a complete backup in case you later need it. If your 2011 Mac Pro subsequently dies then you could buy another second-hand identical 2011 Mac Pro at that time and put the drive in it, for example. (Or if that were to happen you could just buy a new Mac at the time, and install Hauptwerk and your sample sets on it.)
Best regards, Martin.
Hauptwerk software designer/developer, Milan Digital Audio.
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larason2

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Re: Which option to choose ?

PostSun Jun 13, 2021 10:42 am

The BIOS is independent of any drive, and you can access it and set which drive you want to boot from, so even if a drive goes bad, you can just access the bios and set it to boot from any drive you wish.
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engrssc

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Re: Which option to choose ?

PostSun Jun 13, 2021 11:24 am

Technically BIOS is firmware used to perform hardware initialization during the booting (startup) process, and to provide runtime services for operating systems and programs. The BIOS firmware comes pre-installed on a personal computer's mother board, and it is the first software to run when powered on prior to seeing the desktop screen. It basically runs in the background

Unless someone is familiar with how to deal with BIOS, my suggestion is to leave it for someone who knows how.

From time to time, computer companies (and esp motherboard manufacturers) issue BIOS updates. Not especially hard these days to deal with, but making a mistake can render a computer unrepairable.

Understand, the BIOS does not "live" on a computer's drive(s) but rather is a set of computer instructions (embedded) in firmware built into the computer's core processor software. It is responsible for booting up your system. Typically embedded into your computer as a motherboard (microprocessor) chip, the BIOS functions as a catalyst for PC (or Mac) functionality action.

In the simplest form, when a computer is turned on, the motherboard receives power which includes the chip containing the BIOS. The BIOS has been programmed to "find and start" the Operating System which has been installed on a computer's drive(s). The Operating System then begins to start the procedures it has been programmed to do.

Rgds,
Ed
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Re: Which option to choose ?

PostSun Jun 13, 2021 1:11 pm

And, just for clarity, Apple computers do not have a BIOS, which is a PC thing. Macs have EFI (Extensible Firmware Interface) and SMC (System Management Controller). I believe the new Intel Macs have the SMC baked into the T2 security chip. Unless one really knows what they are doing, best to not touch it.
Ray
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