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Sample sets- Size of the screens

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bourdon

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Sample sets- Size of the screens

PostFri Mar 08, 2024 11:27 am

I have often regretted that , unlike many applications, one can not adjust precisely to one's computer screen the size of the screen of a sample set , just by draging the sides with the mouse ( or with à % device) : Typicaly, whith the original size of sample screen , there is waisted space , and the menu "zoom" only offers a maximum enlargement , which is generally too big to fit on a "normal" usual desktop ( or laptop) computer screen .
Does anyone know why so simple a device could not be achieved on HW ?
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mdyde

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Re: Sample sets- Size of the screens

PostFri Mar 08, 2024 12:35 pm

Hello Bourdon,

If the "View | Zoom virtual console to fit" option is ticked, the level of magnification is chosen to ensure that whole of the virtual console will fit within the screen space available (preserving its aspect ratio, and with a narrow black border in the best-fitting direction, e.g. above and below in the case of a 4:3 aspect ratio virtual console on a laptop of wider aspect ratio). E.g. like this:

StAWithZoomOn1.jpg


Do you mean that you would prefer the virtual console to be zoomed in further than that, even though the whole of the console would potentially no longer be visible at once, e.g. with some of the top and/or bottom scrolled off the screen, so you would potentially need to scroll to reach parts of it?

If so, I don't think anybody has ever requested that before, so presumably most people do prefer to see the whole console at once (as happens currently).
Best regards, Martin.
Hauptwerk software designer/developer, Milan Digital Audio.
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vpo-organist

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Re: Sample sets- Size of the screens

PostFri Mar 08, 2024 2:29 pm

Hello bourdon,
you should be more specific about what you want to achieve. If you mean the main console, then I agree with Martin.
If it's basically about the register arrangement for operation, then I can understand you. If you use a layout automatism for this (so-called flow layout), which, for example, automatically continues the display in the next line when the right edge is reached, then you get a layout that nobody wants.
In my opinion, the optimal solution is to define a specific sequence of stops for a specific screen. Writing this now gives me a new idea for my Midi-Panel, which can be used to fulfill such wishes (in progress!).

Best regards
Wolfgang
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mnailor

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Re: Sample sets- Size of the screens

PostFri Mar 08, 2024 2:36 pm

I can see that zooming further in the available space would cut off the organ's tabs or the bottom of the bench and pedalboard, so that's a tough call.

But could there be a view toggle to remove the non-organ rows from top and bottom (menu bar, mini control panels, status bar) to allow more vertical space for a zoom on the console view? A temporary mute for everything but the organ's graphics? Or a full screen view of just the organ's graphics? (I don't know if you try to keep piston toolbars in that view or not -- I don't use them but assume they would be needed by users who do.)

With some organs that don't have a simple screen view, like Peterborough and Salisbury, I can't zoom in enough to see the stop labels while playing. So even a little extra zoom space could help. (Our cats concur, but only at 3 AM.)

Thank you for considering.
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mdyde

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Re: Sample sets- Size of the screens

PostFri Mar 08, 2024 3:23 pm

Hello Mark,

It would technically be conceivable that some kind of toggle/key/piston could toggle all control panels and piston toolbars to hidden temporarily, so that the virtual console would zoom more to make use of the additional space. I've logged as an enhancement request that you'd find that useful..
Best regards, Martin.
Hauptwerk software designer/developer, Milan Digital Audio.
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mnailor

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Re: Sample sets- Size of the screens

PostFri Mar 08, 2024 4:06 pm

mdyde wrote:Hello Mark,

It would technically be conceivable that some kind of toggle/key/piston could toggle all control panels and piston toolbars to hidden temporarily, so that the virtual console would zoom more to make use of the additional space. I've logged as an enhancement request that you'd find that useful..


Thank you!
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GLMounk

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Re: Sample sets- Size of the screens

PostFri Mar 08, 2024 6:51 pm

That is something I have always wished the screens could do, however I never mentioned it before.
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bourdon

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Re: Sample sets- Size of the screens

PostSat Mar 09, 2024 8:12 am

Martin,
Thanks for your answer.
-->What I mean precisely is that, it would be useful if it was made possible to enlarge the picture of the console ( on the console screen) or of the stops ( on the stops-screen) , in order to make the most of the size of the computer's physical screen ,and without having to scroll.
As suggested, the best way to achieve that is to be able to drag the sides of the picture with the mouse,in order to enlarge it exactly to the size of your computer screen, as can be done in many applications ( or to have a % adjusting menu ).
For instance if you could enlarge the picture of St Annes console to the left and trhe right , supressing the black sides, then the stops would get bigger and easier to read. Same thing with many sample sets where you get stop screens with black " wasted" sides". And, as said previoulsy , when you want to enlarge these screens in order to get more readable stops, the menu gives a much bigger picture that is larger than the computer's screen , so you have to scroll on the scrolling bar that appears when you use this menu ( not practical).
Thanks again!
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mdyde

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Re: Sample sets- Size of the screens

PostSat Mar 09, 2024 8:26 am

Thank, Bourdon, although I'm still not sure I'm clear what you're aiming for:

Considering the screenshot of St. Anne's I posted above, do you mean that you would like to be able to enlarge the St. Anne's virtual console so that it fits the whole width of the screen (eliminating the black areas on the left and right)?

If so, the top and/or bottom of the virtual console would be off-screen, so you would potentially need to scroll up or down to get to those top/bottom areas?
Best regards, Martin.
Hauptwerk software designer/developer, Milan Digital Audio.
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mnailor

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Re: Sample sets- Size of the screens

PostSat Mar 09, 2024 10:08 am

Bourdon,

It seems like, with an approximately 16:10 console picture like St. Anne's, just the console picture itself could possibly be expanded until it fits the screen, stopping when either the sides or the top and bottom have been reached. For St. Anne's, it would hit the top and bottom first and leave some room at the sides. Otherwise, scrolling would be required to access the whole picture. This would leave out everything in the HW window but the picture itself. But you might still have black areas to the sides, depending on the picture's shape, since you can't only fit it horizontally without changing the picture. Is that what you want?

Or would a zoom by two finger touch that just expands/contracts the whole HW window (without adding scrollbars) until you have it where you like it be better? The current dragging on a corner doesn't allow for that since we want to expand the middle of the picture to cover the whole screen. That would be harder to use but more flexible for zooming into a smaller part of the picture at times.

(I have no idea if the graphics library HW uses might handle either method.)
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mdyde

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Re: Sample sets- Size of the screens

PostSat Mar 09, 2024 10:18 am

The St. Anne's

mnailor wrote:It seems like, with an approximately 16:10 console picture like St. Anne'


In landscape format, the St. Anne's virtual console is actually 4:3 aspect ratio. (In my screenshot I made the main Hauptwerk window about 16:9 to give an idea of what it would look like on a 16:9 monitor.) Different sample sets may have virtual consoles designed for different aspect ratios, of course. (St. Anne's also has portrait-format layouts for its stop jamb tabs.)
Best regards, Martin.
Hauptwerk software designer/developer, Milan Digital Audio.
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bourdon

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Re: Sample sets- Size of the screens

PostSat Mar 09, 2024 10:46 am

-- Many thanks to all for the trouble you have taken answering my question.
-- MNAILOR: Your "zoom by 2 fingers" idea in order to adjust exactly to the size of my screen ( and so enlarge as much as possible ,without exceeding the limit that leads to use scroll bars that are in my opinion not very handy for this purpose (because depending on which stops you want to see, you have to scroll ) , is what I have in mind ( or the equivalent =expanding the picture by draging with the mouse on the sides of it).
-- One last example : HINZ LEENS organ ( by SP) :
on my computer ( the screen is 26cm by 41 cm and 48 cm diagonal), the "simple jamb" view leaves 2 black columns on the right and the left. If You want to enlarge the stops to have a better view of their names, by using the menu " VIEW/ ZOOM VIRTUAL CONSOLE TO FIT..." , then you automaticaly get a very large picture with scroll bars , which shows very few stops on the same screen => an expanding system allowing to adjust the picture just to the physical screen would give a bigger and more readable picture but not exceeding the size of the screen .
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mdyde

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Re: Sample sets- Size of the screens

PostSat Mar 09, 2024 11:05 am

Hello Bourdon,

Do you mean you want to be able to stretch the virtual console image horizontally (so as to fill the horizontal space) but not vertically? If so, that would be mean that round draw-knobs would no longer be round for example, and I think that might make the text more difficult to read in some cases (because it would be distorted in aspect ratio).
Best regards, Martin.
Hauptwerk software designer/developer, Milan Digital Audio.
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mnailor

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Re: Sample sets- Size of the screens

PostSat Mar 09, 2024 12:22 pm

I just did some tests to see how the "Zoom virtual console to fit" option behaves, and wasn't expecting what I see.

This is on Windows 11, Hauptwerk 8, single landscape oriented monitor.

With "Show console windows full-screen" always checked, I loaded different organs and toggled the "Zoom virtual console to fit" option on several of each organ's tabs.

1. With Zoom checked, the image always fits within the HW console window, but leaves black margins at top and bottom and both sides except for a few portrait images. So there might be some room to grow the landscape images a bit until the top/bottom margins are consumed.

2. With Zoom unchecked, the behavior varies by organ. I guess there's something about the image files or ODF that triggers the weirdness.

2.A These organs' images are zoomed in huge (yes, with Zoom unchecked), only a small part of the image fits in the HW console window, and there are scrollbars, usually both horizontal and vertical but a couple only have a vertical scrollbar:

SP Adlington
SP Dom Bedos
PG Dusseldorf
EV Johnson
EV IPLA Skinner
EV Northrop
PG Nancy
AA Peterborough

2.B. These organs' images fit in the HW console window and don't have scrollbars. Some are slightly larger than the zoomed image, but most are smaller:

LA Armley
SP Caen
SP Freiberg
PL Schiedam
LA Herford
MDA Metz
MDA Salisbury
MDA St. Anne's
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bourdon

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Re: Sample sets- Size of the screens

PostSat Mar 09, 2024 1:04 pm

--Martin, in reply to your last mail : Yes ans No ! :
==> I would like to stretch the image of the stops screen as much as possible horizontaly AND vertically, depending on the given space ( and observing that you can often gain also a little on the vertical dimension ) .
I understand of course that if you can only stretch the picture on one dimension ( vertical or horizontal), the picture will be a little disproportionned , but it is better than nothing .

- To put all this matter in an other way : the question gets down to : why does Hauptwerk don't allow to modify ( by stretching in either side ) the pictures of the stops-pannels , or of the consoles ?? ( --> for instance, if you look at the console of Weissenau, on which you can pull the tiny stops, the labels are very small and can't realy be read. But there is a lot of "lost space" around the picture of the keabords and of the stops. So, if you could expand this picture in order to have only the keyboards and stops remaining on the screen, then the stop-abels would become more readable, and so, the purpose achieved !
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