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MIDI over Bluetooth

Building organ consoles for use with Hauptwerk, adding MIDI to existing consoles, obtaining parts, ...
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GeoffUK

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MIDI over Bluetooth

PostThu Oct 15, 2020 5:12 pm

Hello,

I hope you can give me a steer about how Hauptwerk sees its MIDI inputs?

I have recently built a 2 manual / 32 note pedalboard instrument running HW5 on a MacMini/HIgh Sierra. It was designed to be as portable as possible because we are taking it into secondary schools for demos and workshops. The pedalboard has its own MIDI encoder running on an Arduino Due. I have had it working outputting MIDI commands over USB into the MacMini. To reduce the physical interconnection, I want to pass the pedalboard MIDI stream to the Mac over Bluetooth.

How does HW recognise a MIDI port? Does it look for active tty ports? If so, then should it find the native MacMini Bluetooth port when MIDI stream is connected?

My default would be to install a Bluetooth/USB dongle so HW isn’t aware of the the upstream comms but it would be simpler if there was an OSX config to set it up.

Thanks,
Geoff
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larason2

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Re: MIDI over Bluetooth

PostThu Oct 15, 2020 5:32 pm

In the past, Bluetooth has not been recommended for audio output from Hauptwerk because of the lag, so you may find the lag unacceptable for MIDI over Bluetooth as well. In theory though, any system device producing MIDI signals would be functional. Just make sure it is recognized when Hauptwerk starts, and check off the box for MIDI in. Note that Hauptwerk does not support hot swapping, so make sure your peripheral is connected and on before you start Hauptwerk. On Mac OSX, any MIDI peripheral has to be present in the system MIDI application. If you don’t see a driver there, HW won’t recognize it.
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engrssc

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Re: MIDI over Bluetooth

PostThu Oct 15, 2020 7:07 pm

Going thru all the b/t stuff on both ends vs plugging in a single USB cable?? Not sure I understand the why. :?

Rgds,
Ed
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Grant_Youngman

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Re: MIDI over Bluetooth

PostFri Oct 16, 2020 3:00 am

How are your keyboards connected to the mini?

In my console, for example, I use a Moto Micro Lite for standard midi cable interfaces from 3 keyboards. The USB output from the Micro Lite and other USB interfaces (pedalboard and toe piston Midi, plus two touch screen outputs) all go to a powered USB hub, with a single USB output to my Mac mini. Simple, and it works.

Bluetooth can (depending on B/T version) have as much as a 150-250 ms delay. Doesn't sound like much, but I think that could cause some problems.
Grant
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GeoffUK

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Re: MIDI over Bluetooth

PostFri Oct 16, 2020 3:35 am

Thanks for all your replies.
The reason I wanted to not have a USB cable from pedalboard up to the keyboards (the MacMini is in the back of the keyboard case) is because the instrument needs to be assembled and connected in a short time when we go into a school. The keyboards go on a table and the USB goes down the back into the pedalboard. I managed to inadvertently pull on that cable and wreck the micro USB socket it plugged into on the Arduino.

I'll persevere a bit further and see if it's usable in both setup actions and latency. If not, I'll revert to the cable with some clamps to protect it.

Thanks again,
Geoff
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mdyde

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Re: MIDI over Bluetooth

PostFri Oct 16, 2020 3:51 am

Hello Geoff,

To add to others' replies:

GeoffUK wrote:How does HW recognise a MIDI port? Does it look for active tty ports? If so, then should it find the native MacMini Bluetooth port when MIDI stream is connected?


Hauptwerk simply queries the list of MIDI IN ports and MIDI OUT ports from macOS at the point in time at which Hauptwerk is launched, in the standard way, i.e. via macOS' CoreMIDI API. Hence Hauptwerk should see whatever MIDI ports macOS reports as being present (as shown via macOS' built-in 'Audio/MIDI Setup' application).
Best regards, Martin.
Hauptwerk software designer/developer, Milan Digital Audio.
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engrssc

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Re: MIDI over Bluetooth

PostFri Oct 16, 2020 4:47 am

GeoffUK wrote:I managed to inadvertently pull on that cable and wreck the micro USB socket it plugged into on the Arduino.


Another option could be to cut the USB cable at some convenient spot and "convert" to something for example like a XLR connector which is much more rugged than a USB connector. So you would have a USB (connector) cable to XLR female connector. Then XLR male connector back to USB connector. If You are using USB 2.0, that uses only 4 conductors.

There are other wireless MIDI connection systems that are used by pro on-stage performers but they are fairly costly and require a power source at both ends.

Rgds,
Ed
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IainStinson

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Re: MIDI over Bluetooth

PostFri Oct 16, 2020 9:32 am

Very occasionally I use a Yamaha MD-BT01 to connect a keyboard (using its five pin midi in and out sockets to play HW (under Windows). This uses Bluetooth transmission technology and it works fine. It draws its power from the midi sockets on the keyboard.

I assume this is the IAO project Schools project referred to in recent their Council notes for local associations. Very worth while. Thanks for undertaking this.

Kind regards

Iain
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murph

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Re: MIDI over Bluetooth

PostFri Oct 16, 2020 10:19 am

For USB, try using something like this:

https://www.elara.ie/productdetail.aspx ... MMEV930891

attached to the wood on the pedalboard, so the socket on the Arduino gets no pressure when the cable gets pulled.

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