Stepper - can you insert an extra frame?

Suppose that you have set up the registration for the piece in the stepper, and then while practising it you find that you missed a stop change, or maybe decided that you wanted an additional one. Is there any way of inserting an extra stepper frame into the middle of a sequence, so that subsequent (non-blank) frames shift along one place? Otherwise it would be a lot of work to re-enter subsequent frames, together with a risk of further mistakes.

Also on the subject of the stepper, it seems to me that it can provide a more flexible substitute for general pistons. If you set up a series of pistons so that they trigger consecutive stepper frames (xx1, xx2, xx3... ) then you could set up a series of default registrations for 001, 002, 003... as you would do for general pistons, and when you set up the stepper for sequencing a particular piece, just make sure that you start at a higher number (011, 012, 013... for Piece A, 021, 022, 023... for piece B). Provided that you reset the stepper to 000 when you have finished, you will have your generals back. And if you have fewer than 10 physical controls to use as general pistons the stepper has a setting for restricting the number of frames per "page".

[mdyde]

Hello Julian,

Suppose that you have set up the registration for the piece in the stepper, and then while practising it you find that you missed a stop change, or maybe decided that you wanted an additional one. Is there any way of inserting an extra stepper frame into the middle of a sequence, so that subsequent (non-blank) frames shift along one place? Otherwise it would be a lot of work to re-enter subsequent frames, together with a risk of further mistakes.

There is no native functionality for inserting stepper frames currently (although you can technically do it manually by recalling the highest frame number, storing it the frame numbered one higher, and so on downwards). Adding the ability to insert/delete/re-order/etc. stepper frames has been requested lots of times before, and is logged as a high priority enhancement request, and one that we do hope to implement in the future.

lso on the subject of the stepper, it seems to me that it can provide a more flexible substitute for general pistons. If you set up a series of pistons so that they trigger consecutive stepper frames (xx1, xx2, xx3... ) then you could set up a series of default registrations for 001, 002, 003... as you would do for general pistons, and when you set up the stepper for sequencing a particular piece, just make sure that you start at a higher number (011, 012, 013... for Piece A, 021, 022, 023... for piece B). Provided that you reset the stepper to 000 when you have finished, you will have your generals back. And if you have fewer than 10 physical controls to use as general pistons the stepper has a setting for restricting the number of frames per "page".

Am I correct in understanding that you're just mentioning one way that you could use the existing stepper, as opposed to requesting any new functionality be added? (If I understand what you're suggesting correctly, you could certainly use the stepper as it stands for that, and people often do, by starting pieces in a recital at particular frame number intervals, e.g. 000, 010, 020, ..., or 000, 100, 200, ... .)

Thank-you Martin, as always.

With regard to the use of the stepper in place of general pistons, I realised this possibility yesterday while re-reading the manual (it is amazing how many things you miss first time around). I also realised that the "copy and paste" facility was simply a way of effectively setting a single general piston (the paste piston) by using only one button press (the copy piston) rather than using the setter / capture button, which requires more steps to use. I can envisage a situation where this might be useful while playing, though as with most of these playing aids it is largely a matter of personal preference how you choose to use them.

Hitherto I have been playing largely Bach but I am expanding my repertoire into French romantic music and so I have been investigating the myriad ways that HW playing aids can be used. One curious thing is that once you add the facility of changing registration rapidly to a medium-to-large Baroque organ it does open up the possibilities of playing other genres on it, even if the voicing isn't really what the composer had in mind. I have even been wondering to what extent a crescendo pedal could be used to imitate (to a limited extent) the effect of an enclosed division coupled to another manual, though this isn't something I have really thought about very much yet (for instance I don't know whether or not the HW Master Crescendo Pedal can be scoped - of course this will be in the manual).

I'm sorry to be taking up your time with so many questions today - I am sitting in a hospital in London attached to a chemotherapy drip while itching to get back to my HW system in Wiltshire...

[mdyde]

Thanks very much, Julian.

No problem at all -- you're very welcome. My very best wishes with the chemotherapy, and a speedy recovery.

I have even been wondering to what extent a crescendo pedal could be used to imitate (to a limited extent) the effect of an enclosed division coupled to another manual, though this isn't something I have really thought about very much yet (for instance I don't know whether or not the HW Master Crescendo Pedal can be scoped - of course this will be in the manual).

The master crescendo pedal can't separately be 'scoped' as such, but it inherently only every affects the stops that you tell it to (turning them on as the pedal is depressed, and, as you release it, turning them off if and only if it turned them on). Hence the effect is very similar to scoping.

I was dissapointed that the whole stepper set up process was not simplified for HWV. I do not find it easy or intuitive. Maybe it could be re-designed and included in an upgrade at some stage.

[mdyde]

Hello Erzhaler,

(Apart from adding the ability to insert/delete/re-order/etc. stepper frames and perhaps a few other minor additional functions, such as optionally allowing numbering to be shown one-based, and optionally for cued-tens increment/decrement functions to wrap into the cued-hundreds digits, and optionally for the tens/hundreds increment/decrement functions to to affect the current frame immediately) I don't think we were planning on making any changes to the fundamental design of the stepper. Personally, I think it works very well, is easy to learn and use, very powerful, and it works and is used in essentially the same way that steppers on many real cathedral organs do/are.

Can you be more specific? What do you find overly difficult or complex? What specifically would you want it to do additionally or instead?

Is there any way of inserting an extra stepper frame into the middle of a sequence, so that subsequent (non-blank) frames shift along one place?

I would like to add my vote for this enhancement. I use the stepper instead of the crescendo pedal because I like the control it provides. The ability to "insert" a step would be easier than copying each piston one by one to a different place in the sequence. This is not only time consuming, it inevitably seems to increase the possibility of error.

You can edit the stepper frames, including inserting a blank frame. This is described in the HW 7 manual starting at page 115. The feature was added in HW 6.
Iain

Voet,

I originally posted my query over two years ago. There have been several upgrades to HW since then and I think this feature is now in place. As it happens I hardly use the stepper any more, however, as I have started having organ lessons once again and my teacher thinks that it is a lazy way of playing. Also very few organs in the UK have steppers, so becoming fluent in the use of divisional pistons is a much more useful skill.

One enhancement that I would like is something that would function like Cavaille-Coll divided wind chests, with the anches (reeds and upperwork) toggled on and off using a ventil. Much romantic French music is written for such an instrument with specific instructions as to when the anches should be added or removed. I know modern pistons are more flexible, but using the ventils (which is possible with CC samplesets such as Caen) forces me to think about the music differently.

[mdyde]

One enhancement that I would like is something that would function like Cavaille-Coll divided wind chests, with the anches (reeds and upperwork) toggled on and off using a ventil. Much romantic French music is written for such an instrument with specific instructions as to when the anches should be added or removed. I know modern pistons are more flexible, but using the ventils (which is possible with CC samplesets such as Caen) forces me to think about the music differently.

Hello Julian,

Sample sets can certainly include such functionality within their internal logic/'plumbing', as the Cavaille-Coll ones do you mention. I've logged as an enhancement request that you'd also like some kind of 'master ventil' functions which muted/disabled user-selected ranks directly.

Mea culpa. While I do try to keep up with the enhancements in each iteration of HW, I obviously missed this one. So, my appreciation for this addition.

One enhancement that I would like is something that would function like Cavaille-Coll divided wind chests, with the anches (reeds and upperwork) toggled on and off using a ventil.

Could this be accomplished with a reversible piston/toe stud? Some organs have a reversible "Reeds on/off" piston. I realize that this would function a bit differently than a ventril, but if it were programmable, you might be able to accomplish the same thing.

The HW master reversibles can be used to bring in and out divisional chorus reeds and upperwork much like Anches windchest ventils on C-C organs. But it's only a partial emulation because, with ventils, you can draw exactly the stops you want the ventil to control during that movement, not a fixed registration like on a reversible. But you can set a new subset of stops on each reversible toe stud you're using for Anches at the start of a movement, so it's really at least as flexible as C-C ventils, and somewhat more useful.

Anches stops weren't consistent enough across organs to use without some fiddling around. For example, say you draw fonds 8 and prepare Anches 8 4 +. If the Anches windchest on that division doesn't have any of the fonds 4, do you want the 2' and mixture with a gap? Does the Clairon 4 unsupported by a 4' flue sound right for the music? Another example: Oloron's Hautbois is on the Anches ventil, while composers expect it with the fonds, so adding the Trompette to fonds 8 + Hb is a by-hand operation at times when you can't take your hands off the keyboard and need a toe stud to do it.

It's easier and more consistent to use reversibles, and prepare them as needed for each piece, in my opinion.

Mark (I did get your name right this time I hope),

Now that you have explained it, I realise that the anches functionality can be duplicated by a pair of scoped pistons for each division with the scope set to whatever you consider the anches to be for that particular organ. Prior to playing you draw whichever anches you need and set the piston to those, and use the second piston (set to nothing) to cancel them. The two together are the same as turning the anches on and off. The only thing you can't do is change the prepared anches registration easily while playing on the fonds.

I think you could probably do the same using a reversible piston, which would only require one, as it toggles on and off. However, if you push in one of the stops that you have set it to, then pressing it would pull it out again and you would need to press it twice to cancel them, which could be a bit confusing.

Which stops you include among the anches would clearly depend on how the organ is voiced, so I wouldn't expect it to be consistent between different instruments, particularly from different makers.

Nevertheless, I would still like to have the option of a native HW set of CC-type ventils.

It's true about turning off one stop and altering the state of the reversible so the next press does the wrong thing. I don't try to use the touchscreen during a piece since it's on the left and my left hand shakes, so that never occurred to me. I use nothing but pistons and toe studs once I start playing.

I've never liked that the state of a reversible controlling more than one stop can be changed by doing anything other than pressing the same reversible again. I'd like the next action to alternate between on and off.

I get in trouble when other pistons happen to have turned on all the reversible's stops and I press it (for the first time since cancel) only to have it turn off what I wanted to make sure was turned on. It's not like I can see the lighted button on the screen, while reading music, to know that it's on when I hadn't pressed it myself. It would be easier if pressing the reversible had a predictable next effect without any external influences. First press after cancel turns on whatever stops aren't on already. Next press turns off the stops that the last press turned on if they're still on. No external changes would change whether the next press is on or off, except cancel or restarting the organ. Oh, well. Of course, the current behavior works very well for using a reversible to control a single stop/coupler/trem. It's just hard for me to keep track of when it controls a combination that can be turned on by a sequence of other pistons.

After re-reading the section on reversible pistons, I believe there may be some confusion about how they operate. (Perhaps I am the only one confused.) I found the following points from the HW manual helpful:

1. If you press the [reversible] piston when it isn’t lit, it will always turn on all of the virtual switches it controls that that aren’t already on.

2. If you press it again (now that it’s lit) it will turn those virtual switches off again. However, it won’t turn off switches that it didn’t turn on, so if you’d turned some of its switches on by hand before you used the piston to turn on the remainder in point 1, then your original hand-registered stops would remain on after you’d pressed the piston again this time (to turn it off).

3. If you’d used the piston to turn some stops on, it will remain lit until you press it to turn them off again, as long as it has some stops to turn off, even if you turn some (but not all) of its stops off by hand in the meantime. Thus the rule is that a reversible being lit means that pressing it will cause some (or all) of the stops it’s configured to control to be turned off.

4. There’s one special exception to the rule in point 2: if the reversible isn’t already lit (meaning that it has no switches to turn off) and you turn on all its switches by some other means (by hand, for example), then it will light up so that you have a quick convenient short-cut to turn them all off again. In that special case pressing the piston will turn all of its switches off, even though it didn’t actually turn any of them on.