Controlling Reverb and Wet Sample Sets

In versions 5+, how do you control the "wetness" of wet sample sets? In the previous versions, one would truncate release tails, but that seems to only be an option if you load additional perspectives now.

I'm only using perspective "0" or "1" depending on which is offered. I thought the "panning slider" used to reduce the reverb in version 5. Am I mistaken?

Thank you!

[mdyde]

Hello Mike,

You can still truncate ranks' reverb tails via the "Organ | Load organ, adjusting rank audio memory options" screen in v5+, in the same way that you could in v4.

Additionally, in v5+ you can truncate ranks' reverb tails in real-time (without needing to re-load the sample set) via the voicing screen, and you can do that independently for each of the four possible output perspectives. For any given one of the four output perspectives, that voicing slider will only have an effect if you are actually routing audio through that output perspective. (With default settings, all ranks' audio is 'panned'/routed only through the first of the four output perspectives.)

All of those things are unchanged in v6 and v7, compared to v5.

Another option with 5+ is to increase the sustain volume relative to the release without truncating. I do that to clear up Salisbury a bit without shortening the reverb. In Rank voicing, send some small percentage, say 25, to perspective 2, truncate releases for perspective 2, and in Rank routing, send perspective 2 to the same bus group as perspective 1.

Another option with 5+ is to increase the sustain volume relative to the release without truncating. I do that to clear up Salisbury a bit without shortening the reverb. In Rank voicing, send some small percentage, say 25, to perspective 2, truncate releases for perspective 2, and in Rank routing, send perspective 2 to the same bus group as perspective 1.

Thanks. Salisbury is the set I use most. So, I'll have to try your suggestion.

Hello Mike,

You can still truncate ranks' reverb tails via the "Organ | Load organ, adjusting rank audio memory options" screen in v5+, in the same way that you could in v4.

Additionally, in v5+ you can truncate ranks' reverb tails in real-time (without needing to re-load the sample set) via the voicing screen, and you can do that independently for each of the four possible output perspectives. For any given one of the four output perspectives, that voicing slider will only have an effect if you are actually routing audio through that output perspective. (With default settings, all ranks' audio is 'panned'/routed only through the first of the four output perspectives.)

All of those things are unchanged in v6 and v7, compared to v5.

Thank you Martin. I might have missed this option because I've only tweaked voicing for "all perspectives" and not just 1 perspective. I'll have to look through the options again, and see if I can test it.

[mdyde]

Thanks, Mike.

Another option with 5+ is to increase the sustain volume relative to the release without truncating. I do that to clear up Salisbury a bit without shortening the reverb. In Rank voicing, send some small percentage, say 25, to perspective 2, truncate releases for perspective 2, and in Rank routing, send perspective 2 to the same bus group as perspective 1.

Thanks. Salisbury is the set I use most. So, I'll have to try your suggestion.

For better clarity I do something similar (-1 db for perspective 1 and -5 db for real-time trimmed perspective 2) for the OAM Metzler Poblet and SP Boizard St.-Michel-en-Thiérache.

I wish HW7 (maybe the HW8?) have a pan adjustment between some primary inputs (between front 1/main and front 2/upper, and between rear 1/main and rear 2/upper), so I could easily adjust audio balance between 1-4 perspectives.

Also, it would be great if turning off buses entries would not forget their current level adjustments nor reset them to 0 dB when back on, for the sake of a quick experimentation and to recover previous balance settings.

[mdyde]

Hello abaymajr,

Also, it would be great if turning off buses entries would not forget their current level adjustments nor reset them to 0 dB when back on, for the sake of a quick experimentation and to recover previous balance settings.

I've logged as an enhancement request that on the Audio Mixer screen you would like sends' "Level adjust" settings to recall their previous settings if you disable and re-enable their associated sends.

I wish HW7 (maybe the HW8?) have a pan adjustment between some primary inputs (between front 1/main and front 2/upper, and between rear 1/main and rear 2/upper), so I could easily adjust audio balance between 1-4 perspectives.

Do you mean that (for convenience) you'd like additional "Perspective mix: ..." adjustments on the voicing screen which increase the level of one output perspective whilst simultaneously decreasing another, i.e. which adjust the 'balance' between pairs of existing output perspective level adjustments, so as to avoid the need to change both separately?

I wish HW7 (maybe the HW8?) have a pan adjustment between some primary inputs (between front 1/main and front 2/upper, and between rear 1/main and rear 2/upper), so I could easily adjust audio balance between 1-4 perspectives.

Do you mean that (for convenience) you'd like additional "Perspective mix: ..." adjustments on the voicing screen which increase the level of one output perspective whilst simultaneously decreasing another, i.e. which adjust the 'balance' between pairs of existing output perspective level adjustments, so as to avoid the need to change both separately?

Yes, a convenience feature that does the quick job of changing the balance between front 1 and front 2 outputs (increase the level of one output whilst simultaneously decreasing another), between rear 1 and rear 2 outputs, and between front 1/2 and rear 1/2 pairs. A kind of perspective panning between these four outputs.

Along those lines, I'd like to see a mini control panel with four sliders all visible, each independently adjusting the perspective mix of one perspective at a time, rather than balance controls between subsets of the perspectives. Balance sliders are less clear in their combined effect, and make intuitive sense only by imposing a directional/positional interpretation on the four perspectives (which is nothing but a default labelling suggestion in the software).

This would merely save one from selecting all ranks, then finding and moving a master slider, in Rank routing -- not a big time-saver -- but seeing the 4 sliders in one place and hearing the changes would make adjustments easier.

Thanks!

Yes, I tried to submit the suggestion the right way. As usual: "There was an error trying to send your message. Please try again later." Later doesn't ever arrive.

[mdyde]

Thanks, abaymajr.

I wish HW7 (maybe the HW8?) have a pan adjustment between some primary inputs (between front 1/main and front 2/upper, and between rear 1/main and rear 2/upper), so I could easily adjust audio balance between 1-4 perspectives.

Do you mean that (for convenience) you'd like additional "Perspective mix: ..." adjustments on the voicing screen which increase the level of one output perspective whilst simultaneously decreasing another, i.e. which adjust the 'balance' between pairs of existing output perspective level adjustments, so as to avoid the need to change both separately?

Yes, a convenience feature that does the quick job of changing the balance between front 1 and front 2 outputs (increase the level of one output whilst simultaneously decreasing another), between rear 1 and rear 2 outputs, and between front 1/2 and rear 1/2 pairs. A kind of perspective panning between these four outputs.

I've logged it as an enhancement request. (When the output perspective mix adjustments were added for v5 I did actually strongly consider making front-rear, up-down output perspective mix adjustments, instead of individual level adjustments for the perspectives, but felt in the end that the individual levels provided the maximum flexibility in the simplest way. I've noted in the enhancement request that you'd also like additional convenience/'shortcut' adjustments which vary the ratios of pairs of the existing level adjustments accordingly.)

[mdyde]

Along those lines, I'd like to see a mini control panel with four sliders all visible, each independently adjusting the perspective mix of one perspective at a time, rather than balance controls between subsets of the perspectives. Balance sliders are less clear in their combined effect, and make intuitive sense only by imposing a directional/positional interpretation on the four perspectives (which is nothing but a default labelling suggestion in the software).

This would merely save one from selecting all ranks, then finding and moving a master slider, in Rank routing -- not a big time-saver -- but seeing the 4 sliders in one place and hearing the changes would make adjustments easier.

Thanks!

Thanks Mark.

I've logged as an enhancement request that you'd like four control panel sliders which somehow control/scale/override the four output perspective mix voicing sliders for all ranks.

Thank you!

I've logged it as an enhancement request. (When the output perspective mix adjustments were added for v5 I did actually strongly consider making front-rear, up-down output perspective mix adjustments, instead of individual level adjustments for the perspectives, but felt in the end that the individual levels provided the maximum flexibility in the simplest way. I've noted in the enhancement request that you'd also like additional convenience/'shortcut' adjustments which vary the ratios of pairs of the existing level adjustments accordingly.)

IMHO, I think three knobs panning/balancing between front 1 and front 2, rear 1 and rear 2, and between front and rear pairs, would be the easiest way to make real perspective adjustments, while maintaining the same overall output level and so avoiding audio clipping or low output. This would not exclude the existing individual input level settings, on the contrary. Such adjustments would be useful for leveling these perspective inputs when their sound levels are not originally leveled each other.

For a few days now, I've been trying to use the intermed mix entries for this purpose, outputting to them eight different balance combinations between 3 (primary) perspectives, and connecting to the master mix only the intermed mix corresponding to the desired combination at a giving moment. I still have to mute the other 7 intermed outputs, but, although it's more limiting, this is better and faster than remembering/changing each perspective level combination. I ask: are the primary and intermed mixes which do not result in an effective sound output still processed, generating CPU overhead?

Also, I would like to take the opportunity to make a small suggestion. Since the number of mix presets has been dramatically increased, with the benefit of a possible use of each of them for different samplesets, it would be interesting to be able to rename the mix preset in order to avoid inadvertently changes to a mix preset which is not intended by the user to be shared among two or more samplesets. To avoid this, I've been renaming the first master mix entry, adding to it a convenient keyword, but it would be even better if the preset mix itself could be renamed. Alternatively, that all the mix presets become individualized for each sampleset through an organ/general option.

[mdyde]

Hello abaymajr,

I've logged it as an enhancement request. (When the output perspective mix adjustments were added for v5 I did actually strongly consider making front-rear, up-down output perspective mix adjustments, instead of individual level adjustments for the perspectives, but felt in the end that the individual levels provided the maximum flexibility in the simplest way. I've noted in the enhancement request that you'd also like additional convenience/'shortcut' adjustments which vary the ratios of pairs of the existing level adjustments accordingly.)

IMHO, I think three knobs panning/balancing between front 1 and front 2, rear 1 and rear 2, and between front and rear pairs, would be the easiest way to make real perspective adjustments, while maintaining the same overall output level and so avoiding audio clipping or low output. This would not exclude the existing individual input level settings, on the contrary. Such adjustments would be useful for leveling these perspective inputs when their sound levels are not originally leveled each other.

If using the four output perspectives as 'perspectives' (front, rear, up, down) then yes -- balance/pan-type adjustments would be quicker. However, some people (including, I think, Mark) use them for other things (e.g. for feeding to a parallel reverb mix, or to monitor speakers, or to a recording mix), for which balance/pan adjustments could be awkward. It was implemented the way it is to allow both uses. Hence I think we would definitely not want to sacrifice the existing adjustments, but I wrote in the enhancement request that you'd appreciate some additional ones for maximum convenience for balance/pan-type use.

For a few days now, I've been trying to use the intermed mix entries for this purpose, outputting to them eight different balance combinations between 3 (primary) perspectives, and connecting to the master mix only the intermed mix corresponding to the desired combination at a giving moment. I still have to mute the other 7 intermed outputs, but, although it's more limiting, this is better and faster than remembering/changing each perspective level combination. I ask: are the primary and intermed mixes which do not result in an effective sound output still processed, generating CPU overhead?

- If a mixer send is muted it will consume no CPU overheads.
- If no non-silent audio is being routed to any given mixer bus then the bus will will consume no CPU overheads.
- If non-silent audio *is* being routed to a given mixer bus and its sends are non-muted then its non-muted sends will add some overhead, but it will be so tiny that you really shouldn't need to worry about it (unless you're using hundreds of buses simultaneously).

Also, I would like to take the opportunity to make a small suggestion. Since the number of mix presets has been dramatically increased, with the benefit of a possible use of each of them for different samplesets, it would be interesting to be able to rename the mix preset in order to avoid inadvertently changes to a mix preset which is not intended by the user to be shared among two or more samplesets. To avoid this, I've been renaming the first master mix entry, adding to it a convenient keyword, but it would be even better if the preset mix itself could be renamed.

Yes -- adding the ability to name mixer presets is logged as an enhancement request.